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Sound Deadener Question - COSTS AudioTechnix vs. SoundDeadener Showdown
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<blockquote data-quote="Rudy" data-source="post: 7710239" data-attributes="member: 568035"><p>Options 1 and 2 are apples to oranges and option 2 isn't one I'd give for front doors only. I don't have exact measurements for a '98 Lexus ES300, but it's likely that you'd need 5 CLD Tiles to get to 25% coverage for each outer skin, 1 tile to cut up into smaller pieces for each inner skin and possibly one more for the trim panel.</p><p></p><p>I suspect the gap between the side impact intrusion protection beam and outer skin is filled on your car so unless you plan to use the Extruded Butyl Rope to seal a speaker mounting plate or something similar, you wouldn't need any.</p><p></p><p>The ideal location for MLV is between the inner door skin and trim panel, so how much MLV you'd need would depend on the size of the trim panel and the fact that MLV comes on a 54" wide roll. I can cut any length you'd need so it's likely you'd be able to get by with much less. If you really wanted to go all out, I'd suggest a layer of 3M Thinsulate Acoustic which would push the cost up. Since you're in North Carolina and I'm in Maryland, $20 may cover shipping but remember that you were estimating 27 ft² of MLV. Stuff's heavy - just that and a box has you close to 30 pounds.</p><p></p><p>Aside from all of that, the more important question is what are you trying to accomplish. No vibration damper alone is going to completely stop rattles unless you use it improperly. It will help but you should really consider it a tool to fight resonance. Panel resonance is a problem because it reinforces the music you are playing at the panel's resonant frequency and harmonics thereof. No way to EQ that out. The panel is almost completely transparent to sound at its resonant frequency and that's the crappy droning/humming/buzzing sound you hear from outside of the car. 25% coverage of the sheet metal with a quality vibration damper is enough to control resonance.</p><p></p><p>If your sheet metal is distorting in response to the pressures you are creating, you need to reinforce the sheet metal with something strong and rigid. That's not vibration damper. Brace it.</p><p></p><p>Rattles are always two or more hard objects, one or more of which is vibrating, making intermittent contact. Vibration damper can reduce rattles by reducing the energy available to drive them but that's an indirect approach. The direct approach is either mobilizing the object(s) that is/are moving or to put something soft and resilient between them to stop them from making contact.</p><p></p><p>A perfect example of this is the rear license plate on a car with a trunk. Always rattles if there are subs in the trunk. You could slather vibration damper all over the interior of the trunk and hope to starve the rattle or you could glue 25 cents worth of closed cell foam to the back of the license plate and solve the problem completely, every time.</p><p></p><p>The next possibility is improving the performance of your door mounted speakers by acoustically isolating the front and rear waves they produce. A barrier in the speaker mounting plane does this very well. That's what the MLV and CCF are for, part of what they are for anyway. You could accomplish the same thing by covering the inner skin in 6 or 8 layers of vibration damper, but that would be stupidly expensive and a mess when you needed to get back inside the door for anything.</p><p></p><p>The other thing the CCF and MLV do is block external noise intrusion. As has been mentioned, this makes a big difference in musical reproduction - the less noise what you want to hear has to compete with, the better off you are. Inner skin placement has the advantage of putting noise entering the door through the front, rear, top and bottom behind the barrier. Putting a barrier on the outer skin makes it harder to hear your door mounted speakers from outside the vehicle.</p><p></p><p>In any case, if you're going to compare vibration dampers, you'd be comparing 12 or 14 CLD Tiles alone. When you start talking about all of the there things it's possible to do with a door you get into other materials. There is no one product that will solve all of your problems.</p><p></p><p>Hope that helps.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Rudy, post: 7710239, member: 568035"] Options 1 and 2 are apples to oranges and option 2 isn't one I'd give for front doors only. I don't have exact measurements for a '98 Lexus ES300, but it's likely that you'd need 5 CLD Tiles to get to 25% coverage for each outer skin, 1 tile to cut up into smaller pieces for each inner skin and possibly one more for the trim panel. I suspect the gap between the side impact intrusion protection beam and outer skin is filled on your car so unless you plan to use the Extruded Butyl Rope to seal a speaker mounting plate or something similar, you wouldn't need any. The ideal location for MLV is between the inner door skin and trim panel, so how much MLV you'd need would depend on the size of the trim panel and the fact that MLV comes on a 54" wide roll. I can cut any length you'd need so it's likely you'd be able to get by with much less. If you really wanted to go all out, I'd suggest a layer of 3M Thinsulate Acoustic which would push the cost up. Since you're in North Carolina and I'm in Maryland, $20 may cover shipping but remember that you were estimating 27 ft² of MLV. Stuff's heavy - just that and a box has you close to 30 pounds. Aside from all of that, the more important question is what are you trying to accomplish. No vibration damper alone is going to completely stop rattles unless you use it improperly. It will help but you should really consider it a tool to fight resonance. Panel resonance is a problem because it reinforces the music you are playing at the panel's resonant frequency and harmonics thereof. No way to EQ that out. The panel is almost completely transparent to sound at its resonant frequency and that's the crappy droning/humming/buzzing sound you hear from outside of the car. 25% coverage of the sheet metal with a quality vibration damper is enough to control resonance. If your sheet metal is distorting in response to the pressures you are creating, you need to reinforce the sheet metal with something strong and rigid. That's not vibration damper. Brace it. Rattles are always two or more hard objects, one or more of which is vibrating, making intermittent contact. Vibration damper can reduce rattles by reducing the energy available to drive them but that's an indirect approach. The direct approach is either mobilizing the object(s) that is/are moving or to put something soft and resilient between them to stop them from making contact. A perfect example of this is the rear license plate on a car with a trunk. Always rattles if there are subs in the trunk. You could slather vibration damper all over the interior of the trunk and hope to starve the rattle or you could glue 25 cents worth of closed cell foam to the back of the license plate and solve the problem completely, every time. The next possibility is improving the performance of your door mounted speakers by acoustically isolating the front and rear waves they produce. A barrier in the speaker mounting plane does this very well. That's what the MLV and CCF are for, part of what they are for anyway. You could accomplish the same thing by covering the inner skin in 6 or 8 layers of vibration damper, but that would be stupidly expensive and a mess when you needed to get back inside the door for anything. The other thing the CCF and MLV do is block external noise intrusion. As has been mentioned, this makes a big difference in musical reproduction - the less noise what you want to hear has to compete with, the better off you are. Inner skin placement has the advantage of putting noise entering the door through the front, rear, top and bottom behind the barrier. Putting a barrier on the outer skin makes it harder to hear your door mounted speakers from outside the vehicle. In any case, if you're going to compare vibration dampers, you'd be comparing 12 or 14 CLD Tiles alone. When you start talking about all of the there things it's possible to do with a door you get into other materials. There is no one product that will solve all of your problems. Hope that helps. [/QUOTE]
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