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Reload Thread: help... questions that bugged me for a long long time

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    Sliced's Avatar
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    help... questions that bugged me for a long long time

    any one has opinions on these two issues?

    1. A sub, 2Ohm, powered by an amp that plays 500W @ 2ohm should sound the same as a 4ohm sub powered by an amp that do 500W @ 4Ohm right?

    2. Which of these config would break? pumping 500W clean rms into a sub that handles 800W rms, vs pumping 500W clean rms into a sub that handles 200W rms... that question of under / over powering subs... most sales i met told me underpowering breaks your sub... but that's kinda doesn't make sense to me...

    thanks for your help!








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    Re: help... questions that bugged me for a long long time

    Originally posted by Sliced
    any one has opinions on these two issues?

    1. A sub, 2Ohm, powered by an amp that plays 500W @ 2ohm should sound the same as a 4ohm sub powered by an amp that do 200W @ 4Ohm right?

    2. Which of these config would break? pumping 500W clean rms into a sub that handles 800W rms, vs pumping 500W clean rms into a sub that handles 200W rms... that question of under / over powering subs... most sales i met told me underpowering breaks your sub... but that's kinda doesn't make sense to me...

    thanks for your help!

    I thought 500W would be cleaner, and the ohms will play only a small role.

    ANd underpowering is not so bad..I've done it for 7 years and my subs are still pumping fine... overpowering will allow you to smell what the VC's are made for.



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    ah, sorry typo, i meant 500W into 4ohm as well... basically, same power (500W) into high / low sub resistance... would that make a difference?

    :p




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    500 watts is 500 watts but 4 ohms sometimes can sound alittle cleaner than at 2 ohms (damping factor) but not much.

    underpowering is ok until you crank it to the point where the amp clips because the sub is trying to pull too much power. over powering is sometimes ok depending on subs (some good subs can handle twice their rating). watching the gains is more important when doing this. also listen for any distortion when under or overpowering.




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    just to clear this up the sub does not pull power

    the sub ratted at 800 rms will take 800 rms if the power is clean and the 200 rms sub will survive if you are casious with gains and excursion but any power will be fine providing it is relatively clean and unclipped



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    when u hear a salemen tell u underpowering a sub will hurt it, it is their attempt to get u to buy a bigger/more powerful amp, because bigger/more powerful amps cost more money. when u hear a non-salesmen tell u that underpowering a sub will hurt it, it is called a brain-washed consumer. if this were true, u'd have to run ur system at full potential every single time ur amps turn on, otherwise it'd be underpowering it right? also, why do so many companies recommend you break-in subs at a moderate/low volume for a few hours?



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    Originally posted by bass_mekanik
    just to clear this up the sub does not pull power
    took the words right out of my mouth...

    If I had to make the decision, I would rather underpower a sub than drastically overpower it. 500w into a 200rms sub probably wouldnt be the greatest idea in the world...but then again pushing a XXX with 250 watts would be pretty dumb too.




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    According to physics, you can NEVER 'underpower' a sub (or any speaker) and hurt it.. This has been covered here several times, and is on that eatl.com site (and explained very well).. How could you 'turn down your volume' if it hurt the speakers?? As the original poster suspected, it makes no sense.. and I STRONGLY suggest you immediately LEAVE the store if the salesman tries to convince you that you can "hurt" the sub by underpowering it..

    As for the impedence thing.. not sure exactly.. I would presume 500 watts is 500 watts.. if you have the "same level of clean" on the signal from 2 different amps, one at 2 ohm and one at 4 ohm, I don't think you would hear a difference at all.. The issue is in the power consumption of the amp (if I'm understanding what some people were saying).. 2 ohm will take more power to make the same 500 watts as 4 ohm on the same amp.. and will run hotter.. but, again, that's dependant on the amp.. some amps won't run 2 ohm, or only run 4 ohm bridged (as opposed to 2 ohm bridged), other amps are 0.5 ohm stable and run 1 ohm bridged.. As for the sound (at a certian wattage), it should be the same as long as you have the same "clean signal".. Or, at least that's my understanding of it.. A 2 ohm stable amp just gives you more options I think..

    Oh, and not sure about the damping factor the other guy mentioned.. maybe he meant S/N ?




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    Breaking in a sub is a good thing in my oppion.
    Many drivers will come never used right out of the box (most at that)

    Its hard to say how long they were in there and the spiders and surrounds may be stiff. By running them at low volumes they still vibrate at the same frequency but with the lower amplitude they will stay away from violent strech...

    Just an hour at low volume wont kill you guys
    Plus most people say run it at half the gain you normaly would and slowly increase while the sub is playing hot




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    so u all say theres no difference between 2 ohm and 4 ohm



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    Originally posted by BassRacer
    so u all say theres no difference between 2 ohm and 4 ohm
    I don't know about the rest, I'm jsut assuming here...



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    Awesome guys... very educating, so in short, lower volume levels corresponds to lower wattage output from the amps and thus, not feeding the sub at its rated power and thus the sub should not break .. (provided, yes, the gain was set properly, and it's a clean signal... right?)

    somewhat underpowering would thus be a recommended option for absolute clean bass I suppose?

    :>




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    http://www.eatel.net/~amptech/elecdisc/2ltlpwr.htm

    for those too lazy, i can copy and paste important parts....
    Too little power will only cause the maximum output level to be low. Abuse and the defective 'wing nut' (an idiot) connected to the volume control blow speakers with low powered amplifiers. If driving a speaker with low power would cause them to fail, speakers would fail every time you lower the volume on the head unit.

    Note:
    If your speakers are capable of handling significantly more than your amplifier can produce, driving them with a clipped signal will not likely hurt them.
    If the speakers can handle 3 or 4 times the power that your amplifier can produce, there's virtually no way to damage your speakers (no matter how clipped the signal is).
    If your speakers are rated for the same power handling as your amplifier is capable of producing cleanly, driving them with a clipped signal for extended periods of time may cause speaker damage and/or premature failure.
    If your speakers are rated for the same power handling as your amplifier is capable of producing cleanly, driving them with a square wave signal for extended periods of time will likely cause speaker damage.

    and my favourite line (at the very bottom... "You should remember:
    1.Idiots blow speakers, not low power. "



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    basically, how i see it 500 watts is 500 watts

    when you look at the impedance, 500 watts at 2 ohms is the same 500 watts that you could have with 4 ohms, its just the amp drawing more current to produce those 500 watts at 2 ohms

    basically you can think of resistance as a shutoff valve. at 4 ohms, lets say its half open. and you're running 500 watts from that.

    say you have a different, smaller amp than the one above that is at 2 ohms, you could say that it is 3/4 way open, which is drawing more current, but putting out 500 watts also. thats pretty much how i perceive it.




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    the only difference would be the increased THD most amps produce at lower impedance loads... sometiems its notcieable, sometimes its not...



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    Quote Originally Posted by PT Teal
    I woke up one morning and found a cop at my door telling me he found my car on fire in the middle of the desert.
    Quote Originally Posted by cleanerupper View Post
    Some people have told me that the chrome reflects sunlight, therefore the amp doesn't get as hot as others. Is this true?

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