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Reload Thread: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

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    Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    I've been noticing some lossless steaming options becoming available, and this sounds nice. LOL

    So I've been researching to see when and what services are and will be available. I've been a spotify user for quite some time but quality is... meh. Rumor is they have Lossless quality available. Well in my car I generally only listen to CDs, sometimes I'll listen to spotify for variety but.. meh.

    Well through research I see a lot of claims that "most can't tell the difference in 320kbs or lossless WAV/CD quality even with high quality equipment, especially in car audio." Well I find this very untrue! There is a huge difference from what is on my CD.. and the 320kbs stream from spotify.. like night and day. I've done back to backs on the same song... but I decided to dig deeper.. Some of the CDs I buy come with lossless WAV downloads... I decided to take that to the test.

    What I found was the bluetooth stream seemed to be more of a factor than the actual audio.. the Spotify to WAV wasn't huge, though I thought the WAV still sounded better, that could just be subliminal reasoning.. but the CD was just so much more full and open as compared to the bluetooth stream.

    Have any of you tried to do this comparison? Any ideas how to better get the quality of the music from my phone to the receiver? and perhaps a better receiver? It sounds like Spotify is going to have lossless streaming within the year, I'd like to be able to take full advantage.



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Out of curiosity I checked the Bluetooth standards. Bluetooth version 3 (currently we're up to at least 5) has a maximum speed of 25 MBit/second, and newer versions are faster. Version 1.2 of Bluetooth could handle at least 700 KB/s. A CD rom at regular speeds (aka "1x") has a transfer rate of 150 KB/s. Comparing those numbers, it's highly unlikely that the Bluetooth stream itself is the culprit. If there is a difference, it's likely in software or processing of signal on the part of the receiver or transmitter.

    But I'm spitballing here. A real computer scientist, ECE, or EE would need to chime in.



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by tommymilan311 View Post
    I've been noticing some lossless steaming options becoming available, and this sounds nice. LOL

    So I've been researching to see when and what services are and will be available. I've been a spotify user for quite some time but quality is... meh. Rumor is they have Lossless quality available. Well in my car I generally only listen to CDs, sometimes I'll listen to spotify for variety but.. meh.

    Well through research I see a lot of claims that "most can't tell the difference in 320kbs or lossless WAV/CD quality even with high quality equipment, especially in car audio." Well I find this very untrue! There is a huge difference from what is on my CD.. and the 320kbs stream from spotify.. like night and day. I've done back to backs on the same song... but I decided to dig deeper.. Some of the CDs I buy come with lossless WAV downloads... I decided to take that to the test.

    What I found was the bluetooth stream seemed to be more of a factor than the actual audio.. the Spotify to WAV wasn't huge, though I thought the WAV still sounded better, that could just be subliminal reasoning.. but the CD was just so much more full and open as compared to the bluetooth stream.

    Have any of you tried to do this comparison? Any ideas how to better get the quality of the music from my phone to the receiver? and perhaps a better receiver? It sounds like Spotify is going to have lossless streaming within the year, I'd like to be able to take full advantage.
    Cd plays at what is considered full volume due to direct play.

    Bluetooth needs gain adjustment since you have to match device volume and headunit volume.

    Also 320 and lossless wav are near identical.. flac is much more quality in comparison.

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk




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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by tommymilan311 View Post
    I've been noticing some lossless steaming options becoming available, and this sounds nice. LOL

    So I've been researching to see when and what services are and will be available. I've been a spotify user for quite some time but quality is... meh. Rumor is they have Lossless quality available. Well in my car I generally only listen to CDs, sometimes I'll listen to spotify for variety but.. meh.

    Well through research I see a lot of claims that "most can't tell the difference in 320kbs or lossless WAV/CD quality even with high quality equipment, especially in car audio." Well I find this very untrue! There is a huge difference from what is on my CD.. and the 320kbs stream from spotify.. like night and day. I've done back to backs on the same song... but I decided to dig deeper.. Some of the CDs I buy come with lossless WAV downloads... I decided to take that to the test.

    What I found was the bluetooth stream seemed to be more of a factor than the actual audio.. the Spotify to WAV wasn't huge, though I thought the WAV still sounded better, that could just be subliminal reasoning.. but the CD was just so much more full and open as compared to the bluetooth stream.

    Have any of you tried to do this comparison? Any ideas how to better get the quality of the music from my phone to the receiver? and perhaps a better receiver? It sounds like Spotify is going to have lossless streaming within the year, I'd like to be able to take full advantage.
    actually its more of a factor of, you need a different tune for your BT settings vs your CD settings. Do it right, they sound the same. You cant expect to use the same tune for CD as bluetooth, it doesnt work that way.



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by los33 View Post
    Cd plays at what is considered full volume due to direct play.

    Bluetooth needs gain adjustment since you have to match device volume and headunit volume.

    Also 320 and lossless wav are near identical.. flac is much more quality in comparison.

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffdachef View Post
    actually its more of a factor of, you need a different tune for your BT settings vs your CD settings. Do it right, they sound the same. You cant expect to use the same tune for CD as bluetooth, it doesnt work that way.
    So I suppose the phone I'm using might make a difference? Probably not tho, cause its a Galaxy S8.

    I did do a little bit of playing with volume levels and I found when I turned my phone down a bit.. like all the way down to the "damage your hearing" warning and then I turned my Input adjustment setting at the HU up... all the way up +4. It sounds a lot better, more clear and full. But its way quieter as compared to the CD. The problem is I think the is some internal compression going on with the phone beyond this volume.. I start to lose a full kick drum sound and my cymbals become washed (side by side comparisons).. I've played with the headroom that my head unit allows.. I generally do all my EQ settings from my processor, and it'd stink to have to have to different settings from the processor if I wanted to listen to CD vs Bluetooth

    Also, the HU does allow different EQ settings for each input.



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by tommymilan311 View Post
    So I suppose the phone I'm using might make a difference? Probably not tho, cause its a Galaxy S8.

    I did do a little bit of playing with volume levels and I found when I turned my phone down a bit.. like all the way down to the "damage your hearing" warning and then I turned my Input adjustment setting at the HU up... all the way up +4. It sounds a lot better, more clear and full. But its way quieter as compared to the CD. The problem is I think the is some internal compression going on with the phone beyond this volume.. I start to lose a full kick drum sound and my cymbals become washed (side by side comparisons).. I've played with the headroom that my head unit allows.. I generally do all my EQ settings from my processor, and it'd stink to have to have to different settings from the processor if I wanted to listen to CD vs Bluetooth

    Also, the HU does allow different EQ settings for each input.
    Samsung has preset eq's.

    You need to root it and use viper4android to get a flat eq going and work the gains.

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk




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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by los33 View Post
    Samsung has preset eq's.

    You need to root it and use viper4android to get a flat eq going and work the gains.

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
    Is there still possibility that there is internal compression and distortion to make it sound louder when I go passed the "too loud" volume?



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by tommymilan311 View Post
    Is there still possibility that there is internal compression and distortion to make it sound louder when I go passed the "too loud" volume?
    Viper4android is a dsp its self and controls how the output from the device will be like..

    So you will want to tune it while at full volume.

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk




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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by tommymilan311 View Post
    Is there still possibility that there is internal compression and distortion to make it sound louder when I go passed the "too loud" volume?
    no its just the internal dsp fking your sh*t up. I had to shut mines off when i tune as well, my phone's dsp actually was boosted so it was actually louder than CD/USB and caused some premature clipping.



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by los33 View Post
    Viper4android is a dsp its self and controls how the output from the device will be like..

    So you will want to tune it while at full volume.

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffdachef View Post
    no its just the internal dsp fking your sh*t up. I had to shut mines off when i tune as well, my phone's dsp actually was boosted so it was actually louder than CD/USB and caused some premature clipping.
    Are there any ways to fix this without rooting my phone? all method for the GS8 are sketchy as can be



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by tommymilan311 View Post
    Are there any ways to fix this without rooting my phone? all method for the GS8 are sketchy as can be
    Sketchy? Its just odin with a zip containing root, but no there is not

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk




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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by los33 View Post
    Sketchy? Its just odin with a zip containing root, but no there is not

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
    From what I read.. the Galaxy 8 has fail safes that prevent you from setting it up properly.. I have never rooted my phone because I haven't known what exactly I'd do with it. I'm seeing a lot of folks get stuck in boot lock.



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    IG this is more reason to hate this phone and the Galaxy family. I'll never get one of these POS again lol



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Pretty sure I messed my phone up attempting this



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    Re: Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

    Quote Originally Posted by tommymilan311 View Post
    Pretty sure I messed my phone up attempting this
    https://forum.xda-developers.com/gal...ragon-t3659305

    Do this..

    With samsung phones its impossible to mess up because you can download the stock firmware and redo it all over again over and over and over again.

    Just take your time and read thru it all.

    If not then go buy a usb and put your music or a cd and a headunit that supports both lol

    Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk




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