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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    Quote Originally Posted by ciaonzo View Post
    It's a system so it really depends on various things - vehicle transfer function, driver Q, driver Fs, power applied (may affect driver choice or enclosure volume), etc... This is why everything should be modeled, including the acoustic response of the vehicle interior. I will tune anywhere from 16 to 22hz if being completely musical is my goal, but I also use drivers that have very low Fs numbers. No unloading issues on the bottom end negates the need for any SSF, and I vary the enclosure volume to suit the driver Vas and the power applied to keep unloading above the tuning in check. The goal here is to have a maximally flat frequency and group delay response, while keeping excursion under control. This is what will truly allow you to play anything you want, including tones all day if you want to beat down the block. I listen to metal, classical, jazz, DJ Billy E, whatever. From the head unit, I simply change my high pass settings and EQ profiles to get the sound I want. Smooth, creamy, and extended, or lean, dry, and punchy... whatever I want.

    The kicker, and what many fail to realize, is that, often times, a side effect a true SQ system is the ability to actually get loud. Just depends on the gear being used and the application of it. It's one of the reasons I hate the spawning of the term SQL. Ranks up there with substage.

    ---------- Post added at 12:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:21 PM ----------

    Exactly, thank you.
    You should really come to Frost Off so some of us can hear your set up and put it on the TL just to see what kind of numbers it does. That will give you an idea of what you consider loud.

    I'm pretty much the opposite end of the spectrum compared to your set up, but I'm always interested in hearing what other people have and enjoy...







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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    I don't have a fav tuning frequency. For demos I seem to like stuff that hits in the upper 30's to upper 40's. For daily I never play rap though, mostly 80's metal/dance/pop and old school hip hop. Most of that stuff has a punchy beat...




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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    If I was setting up a purley holy **** that's intense type loud demo setup I'd want to do it at 37-40hz. I hate buzz spl setups. Hitting 155 at 55-60hz is not impressive to me. 150 at 37hz and below though does impress me.



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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    mid/upper 40's will choke you more at those db levels...




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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    Quote Originally Posted by mlstrass View Post
    mid/upper 40's will choke you more at those db levels...
    This is true, seems like it's easier for the subs to activate the sympathetic resonances in your body or something. It's always interesting when your eyes are unable to track perfectly on things, too.

    Not sure what Frost Off is but I've been at this a while, I understand what loud is. I modified my headphones to give 'more bass' when I was twelve, built my first box for a pair of 15" Orions when I was fifteen, finally turning 38 this year and planning on running four 12" LMS drivers this summer. I'm just not impressed with loud the way I am with accuracy. I get a bigger hard-on when I can reproduce 12-15hz at the same perceived amplitude as 25hz, 50hz, and the rest of the audio spectrum (with true pitch definition, not just flatulence activating panels). I say perceived because of things like the Fletcher-Munson curve and the way our hearing scales up and down. Do I give up maximum potential output when I set my system up that way? Of course I do. Do I have more explosive dynamic ability because I'm not running everything within an inch of full capability at all times? Of course I do! But that's because I absolutely could not care less about a number on a machine. Why would I design a system to cater to a single measurement? I care about the beats and melodies in my ear and in my body, not a number popping up on a computer screen. That's just silly and looses sight of what having a stereo in your vehicle is all about.

    Once I get this summer's setup running, I would love to give a demo for anyone interested. Am I going to make a trip to get my SQ system metered? No, that would be ridiculous.



    Quote Originally Posted by audioholic View Post
    Saying "clipping doesn't kill speakers" is a half-truth at best. Technically no, clipping itself does not hurt the speaker. But in clipping your amp, you can easily create a situation that WILL kill the speaker. Was the squared waveform the DIRECT cause of the failure? No. In the end, the answer is, always has been, and can only be... heat kills speakers. BUT, clipping increases heat generation, sometimes by a drastic amount. So to start a thread simply to state that clipping does not hurt speakers is, again, a half-truth at best.

  6. #51
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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    Quote Originally Posted by ciaonzo View Post
    This is true, seems like it's easier for the subs to activate the sympathetic resonances in your body or something. It's always interesting when your eyes are unable to track perfectly on things, too.

    Not sure what Frost Off is but I've been at this a while, I understand what loud is. I modified my headphones to give 'more bass' when I was twelve, built my first box for a pair of 15" Orions when I was fifteen, finally turning 38 this year and planning on running four 12" LMS drivers this summer. I'm just not impressed with loud the way I am with accuracy. I get a bigger hard-on when I can reproduce 12-15hz at the same perceived amplitude as 25hz, 50hz, and the rest of the audio spectrum (with true pitch definition, not just flatulence activating panels). I say perceived because of things like the Fletcher-Munson curve and the way our hearing scales up and down. Do I give up maximum potential output when I set my system up that way? Of course I do. Do I have more explosive dynamic ability because I'm not running everything within an inch of full capability at all times? Of course I do! But that's because I absolutely could not care less about a number on a machine. Why would I design a system to cater to a single measurement? I care about the beats and melodies in my ear and in my body, not a number popping up on a computer screen. That's just silly and looses sight of what having a stereo in your vehicle is all about.

    Once I get this summer's setup running, I would love to give a demo for anyone interested. Am I going to make a trip to get my SQ system metered? No, that would be ridiculous.
    I want to hear it. That is why I asked you if you have ever been to frost off. It is a competition held in Madison, WI at a car audio shop. I went last year because I have never seen that many systems. Only 3 to be exact. So I wanted to see more. I don't get my car metered because it is a daily driver set up. Not looking for a score and could care less about my score. As long as it satisfies my ears. Then I am happy.
    I want to hear your set up when it is done. When do you think you will have it all done?



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  8. #52
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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    Quote Originally Posted by ciaonzo View Post
    This is true, seems like it's easier for the subs to activate the sympathetic resonances in your body or something. It's always interesting when your eyes are unable to track perfectly on things, too.

    Not sure what Frost Off is but I've been at this a while, I understand what loud is. I modified my headphones to give 'more bass' when I was twelve, built my first box for a pair of 15" Orions when I was fifteen, finally turning 38 this year and planning on running four 12" LMS drivers this summer. I'm just not impressed with loud the way I am with accuracy. I get a bigger hard-on when I can reproduce 12-15hz at the same perceived amplitude as 25hz, 50hz, and the rest of the audio spectrum (with true pitch definition, not just flatulence activating panels). I say perceived because of things like the Fletcher-Munson curve and the way our hearing scales up and down. Do I give up maximum potential output when I set my system up that way? Of course I do. Do I have more explosive dynamic ability because I'm not running everything within an inch of full capability at all times? Of course I do! But that's because I absolutely could not care less about a number on a machine. Why would I design a system to cater to a single measurement? I care about the beats and melodies in my ear and in my body, not a number popping up on a computer screen. That's just silly and looses sight of what having a stereo in your vehicle is all about.

    Once I get this summer's setup running, I would love to give a demo for anyone interested. Am I going to make a trip to get my SQ system metered? No, that would be ridiculous.
    You read way more into that then I intended. I thought Madison was your home town, or very close to there. Frost Off is held at The Radio Doctor and is a sound comp, but also plenty of people just come to hang out, demo, and hear other set ups.

    I agree on building to play music and impress the owner, but I still compete just to support whoever is putting on the show.

    Not sure what you're playing in car that goes down to 12hz?




  9. #53
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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    Quote Originally Posted by mlstrass View Post
    You read way more into that then I intended.
    Dammit. Sorry, lol. So hard to tell these things on the innerwebz, sometimes. Indeed, I am close to the Madison area. I'm familiar with Radio Doctor, I might have to swing by there and screw around with some of you guys. If I don't get this large scale build finished, I will try to have an LMS 15 or a pair of LMS 12's or something going and I can show some why I go through all of the trouble of preserving the subsonic frequencies. It's in so much music and very important to the overall presentation if you value fidelity. I wouldn't cut off the 10hz to 20hz bandwidth any sooner than I would cut off the 10Khz to 20Khz bandwidth.



    Quote Originally Posted by audioholic View Post
    Saying "clipping doesn't kill speakers" is a half-truth at best. Technically no, clipping itself does not hurt the speaker. But in clipping your amp, you can easily create a situation that WILL kill the speaker. Was the squared waveform the DIRECT cause of the failure? No. In the end, the answer is, always has been, and can only be... heat kills speakers. BUT, clipping increases heat generation, sometimes by a drastic amount. So to start a thread simply to state that clipping does not hurt speakers is, again, a half-truth at best.

  10. #54
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    Re: Favorite tuning frequency?!

    Quote Originally Posted by ciaonzo View Post
    Dammit. Sorry, lol. So hard to tell these things on the innerwebz, sometimes. Indeed, I am close to the Madison area. I'm familiar with Radio Doctor, I might have to swing by there and screw around with some of you guys. If I don't get this large scale build finished, I will try to have an LMS 15 or a pair of LMS 12's or something going and I can show some why I go through all of the trouble of preserving the subsonic frequencies. It's in so much music and very important to the overall presentation if you value fidelity. I wouldn't cut off the 10hz to 20hz bandwidth any sooner than I would cut off the 10Khz to 20Khz bandwidth.
    Sweet, hope to see you there....




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