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EscaladeESV
11-15-2004, 12:35 AM
Does anyone think putting 2 12"s,1 8", and 1 10" in one box a good idea? lol sounds crazy, but does anybody know what could happen?

B@SSAN8OR
11-15-2004, 12:39 AM
if they all have seperate sealed chambers you could do it

squeak9798
11-15-2004, 12:40 AM
It would sound like crap if they were all playing the same frequencies. If they were playing different frequencies, then it's way overkill and completely unnecessary.

B@SSAN8OR
11-15-2004, 12:46 AM
nothing is overkill. you should learn that if your into car audio. just make different crossovers for each sub to only play certain frequencys. or make a way to turn on and off each sub for different types of music you are listening to

`pr0digy
11-15-2004, 08:56 AM
:rolleyes:

req
11-15-2004, 09:01 AM
nothing is overkill.

isnt all car audio on these forums overkill?

:crazy:

squeak9798
11-15-2004, 09:55 AM
nothing is overkill. you should learn that if your into car audio. just make different crossovers for each sub to only play certain frequencys. or make a way to turn on and off each sub for different types of music you are listening to

:rolleyes:

If someone wants to waste their time, energy and money doing something completely unnecessary (and slightly worthless) then more power to them. It is 100% unneeded, so why even bother?

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 10:08 AM
If they're playing the same frequencies then it's completely worthless because of cancellation problems. If you've got crossovers on everything so they are playing exactly the frequencies they like then you're okay, but it's just not worth it.

When talking about sub frequencies you're talking 20 - 80ish Hz....this is not a wide enough spectrum to split up between 3 different sized drivers IMO. Get yourself a good quality 15 with a well designed enclosure and call it a day.

B@SSAN8OR
11-15-2004, 11:18 AM
a 15 is not going to respond as fast as a 10 or 8 in. people go with smaller subs cause they want to hear the bass note not just feel and and hear the rattle of there car

squeak9798
11-15-2004, 11:27 AM
a 15 is not going to respond as fast as a 10 or 8 in.

Completely false and a great big car audio myth. Woofer "speed" and "sound" (punchy, etc) is dependent upon the box, not the diameter of the sub.


We actually just had this conversation in another thread: http://forums.caraudio.com/vb/showthread.php?t=74565 - read pages 2 & 3 I believe.

So if you have having problems with a 15" sounding "slow" or "muddy", the problem is the box and or tuning and not the sub itself.

Berry47
11-15-2004, 01:28 PM
a 15 is not going to respond as fast as a 10 or 8 in. people go with smaller subs cause they want to hear the bass note not just feel and and hear the rattle of there car

You're new right....

dbornotdb
11-15-2004, 01:32 PM
Completely false and a great big car audio myth. Woofer "speed" and "sound" (punchy, etc) is dependent upon the box, not the diameter of the sub.

So if you have having problems with a 15" sounding "slow" or "muddy", the problem is the box and or tuning and not the sub itself.


If I may add to this..........you also need to upgrade your mid-bass/mid speakers and tweeters. They affect the sounds you are refering to as "slow" "muddy" bass or your bass not being tight enough.

Do you still have your factory speakers hooked up? :evil:

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 02:01 PM
What size drivers are you running right now? I'll bet my car sounds cleaner than yours on the whole sound spectrum...and I'm not even running comps.

On a serious note though, woofer size has nothing to do with the "punchyness" of the driver....not sure if the link that was posted up a few posts ago has the adire audio explanation of this, but you should read it...explains it quite nicely.

P.S. I don't like to hear the rattle of my car either...and well, I don't...barely rattles (sound deadener is a great thing).

the_flatlander
11-15-2004, 02:03 PM
for todays forecast there is a 99.99999% chance for a flame war

woahloud
11-15-2004, 02:30 PM
for todays forecast there is a 99.99999% chance for a flame war



Bwahahahahha.. Thats hillarious!


But back to topic :

If you did that w/ all those sub's, it would be a COMPLETE waste of money....it would be pointless.

Kinda like HUGE wings on imports....What does it actually do? I mean I don't mind people who put them on there because they like them, but I hate the ignorant people who "know" it does something...

squeak9798
11-15-2004, 02:35 PM
If I may add to this..........you also need to upgrade your mid-bass/mid speakers and tweeters. They affect the sounds you are refering to as "slow" "muddy" bass or your bass not being tight enough.

Do you still have your factory speakers hooked up? :evil:

Tru dat, tru dat. Also part of the reason people think 15's are "boomy", they don't have an adequate front stage to properly mate with a larger sub (or any high output sub for that matter).

B@SSAN8OR
11-15-2004, 02:37 PM
you dont even need to go with 15's if the box is designed right for the size sub you have. we have made 8 in drivers hit harder then 12 in drivers. it all depends on the box

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 05:42 PM
^^^^ This is true, it can be done...however if he's asking about using that many different subs, his box designing skills are probably not up to par in creating a box that makes an 8 hit like a 15.

B@SSAN8OR
11-15-2004, 06:00 PM
yes very true

EscaladeESV
11-15-2004, 06:33 PM
well of course this was just at the top of my head. i really really learned a lot by reading all the comments...
n e ways, seriously....how would 2 10"'s and 1 8" sound? would I have to use a ported or sealed box? I'm thinking of putting this in an accord. I already have the 8" sub, so theres no use on saying your wasting your money. its just the 10's I need. im not sure if i'll get better bass or w/e with the 3 subs....but thats why im on here..
p.s. im just a beginner :help:

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 07:14 PM
If you're a beginner, do not mix subs.

What 10's are you looking at? How much do you have to spend on subs? What amp will you be using? How much space do you have/are willing to give up? What kind of sound are you looking for...SQ or SPL?

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 07:16 PM
yes very true
But not likely, please don't tell people they can do things that are very complicated when they're beginners, as you seem to be.

EscaladeESV
11-15-2004, 08:08 PM
Well.... I guess mixing subs is out.

I plan on getting 2 Rockford Fosgate P110S4 Punch 10" (on a budget, of course if there are better subs for the same price please let me know)

As far as the amp, Im not sure. Would a Legacy Series II LA320 2 Channel 500W Bridgeable Amp or maybe a MTX RT251D or a Sony XM2200GTX work. Im not sure. I would like to spend the least amount of money yet still be able to hear the subs 5-10 doors down (my main goal since it will be my first *real* system)

Im not sure what i really want the system to preform.. I was thinking spl, but I have no clue. I have as much trunk space as needed. I might make a box myself (well, attempt) but I can always get these guys from an audio store down the street to make one for me.

Thanks for all the help so far!!!

InhumanAcura
11-15-2004, 08:17 PM
you dont even need to go with 15's if the box is designed right for the size sub you have. we have made 8 in drivers hit harder then 12 in drivers. it all depends on the box

Im sorry, how hard does a 12" driver hit? What kind of statement is that?

B@SSAN8OR
11-15-2004, 08:28 PM
we had 8 in driver hit a higher spl then 12 in drivers

bigred78797
11-15-2004, 09:04 PM
If you put a 12 inch sub in a crappy box and a 8 in sub in a excellently tuned box then yes. If you put a 12 inch sub in a very well tuned box vs a 8 inch sub in an equivalently tuned box then the 12 inch sub will destroy. Technically it is possible but that has to be one sorry *** box and 12. A 12 inch sub has approximately 100 in sq of cone area while a 8 inch sub has about 50 in sq of cone area. Take into conscideration that everytime you double the cone area that's an additional 3db's.
You guys must have put that 12" to 10 watts in a box that was made of balsa wood and put the 8" sub in a perfectly tuned box to pull that one off. Once again it is possible to get an 8 louder that a 12 but in my opinion you have to try really hard to do it.

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 09:12 PM
Bigred is right, it's very hard to do....but it can be done, hell kicker made an 8 L7 hit 148.6 dB, but it's just hard to do in general.

To the other points at hand though...

still be able to hear the subs 5-10 doors down (my main goal since it will be my first *real* system)
Don't say this for the risk of being flamed, it's looked down upon here as that should not be the main, or even secondary, or rather any reason for getting a system.

As far as your situation though, how much do you have to spend total? Legacy amps are garbage, and I know there's better subs for the money than rockfords. Let us know what your budget is and we'll help you out.

Also, the box....make it yourself, but get a design from jmac or someone around here (cost like $5 or $10 for a design). The car audio shop will most likely charge over $200 and you can get it done yourself for ~$25 in materials plus the design fee if you choose to go that route.

EscaladeESV
11-15-2004, 10:26 PM
Don't say this for the risk of being flamed, it's looked down upon here as that should not be the main, or even secondary, or rather any reason for getting a system.

I was trying to get a distance range...not that I would do anything to **** anyone off if thats what you mean. I just want something that you know it can hit hard sometimes. Since my last system was garbage, sadly it sounded almost the same as stock speakers. lol I just want something better.
Thanx for the warning tho. :thumbsup:

My budget is from w/e - $600 (CND) at the most for subs amp and possibly wiring kit

Ya I was thinking of making it myself, although theres a guy on my street that could build one for me, free of charge (If I supply the material)

Also, keeping with the topic, whats a good way to setup subs in honda accord trunk? (shape of the box)

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 10:47 PM
I may be an idiot for asking this, but what's the current conversion rate from the canadian dollar to american? In other words, how much is $600 canadian?

dbornotdb
11-15-2004, 10:54 PM
About $125 right?

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 10:56 PM
Man, I thought it was a lot more than that....anyone else?

EDIT: I got off my lazy *** and looked it up....I get $498, does that sound right to any of you canadians?

EscaladeESV
11-15-2004, 10:57 PM
Canadian dollar to United States dollar
600.000000 Can$ = 498.711662 US$

So i'll say $500 us

monte_carlo97
11-15-2004, 10:59 PM
Live mid-market rates as of 2004.11.16 04:02:55 GMT.
600.00 CAD Canada Dollars = 499.121 USD United States Dollars
1 CAD = 0.831868 USD 1 USD = 1.20211 CAD

monte_carlo97
11-15-2004, 11:03 PM
a 15 is not going to respond as fast as a 10 or 8 in. people go with smaller subs cause they want to hear the bass note not just feel and and hear the rattle of there car
i know this was a comment already flamed but i could not help not saying anything.

This is a very ignorant comment from a person that is suppose to be designing boxes for people professionally. I would never ask you to build a box for me, mr we have made 8's sound louder than 12's. I have said what i wanted to say. Carry on.

swimfreak26
11-15-2004, 11:04 PM
Ok, here's what I would reccomend looking around just a little bit and working with that money...
Viper 600.1 refurb
http://ikesound.com/product-product_id/2426
$149

Now, I was going to reccomend subs, but are you stuck on 10's...or I guess the better question is how much space do you want to give up?

EscaladeESV
11-15-2004, 11:10 PM
hm Im kinda leaning toward 10's....but open to any suggestion. Unlimited trunk space.

That amp looks good, except does it have to be refurbished or will i have money to get a brand new amp. No big deal to me, just questioning.

jujumantb
11-15-2004, 11:19 PM
Back to the origional question...
Even if you did have them all on crossovers being seperated, there is still going to be overlap between them. Crossovers, nomatter what the slope, still have a rolloff. In any audio setup, the less total x-over points the better, you want to use each driver to its FULL range of usefull frequencies, only crossing to a different driver when ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY. IE: From subs to midbass/midrange to tweeter. Or even better: Subbass/midbass to horns.

B@SSAN8OR
11-15-2004, 11:22 PM
i dont actually build any boxes.... i am the alarm installer only....

squeak9798
11-15-2004, 11:23 PM
i dont actually build any boxes.... i am the alarm installer only....


LOL....good thing :thumbsup:



[/easy cheapshot]

DBfan187
11-15-2004, 11:25 PM
LOL....good thing :thumbsup:



[/easy cheapshot]



o0o0ooooooOOOOOOOO :present:

monte_carlo97
11-15-2004, 11:30 PM
i dont actually build any boxes.... i am the alarm installer only....
ok you had me worried there for a second. But back on a serious note i am only kidding. You want to give me some adive on what i all need to do an alarm in my car. Do i just get a alarm and away i go or is there alot else i need and what.


Back on original topic. More than one size sub at a time = bad, very bad. :thumbsdo:

B@SSAN8OR
11-16-2004, 04:35 AM
this thread is basically dead so i wll stray off topic.


you just need the wiring codes for your car...
if you have a GM car then you should get atleast 2 or the different codes from different places . cause gm likes to have wrong colors in each wiring code.

then get relays if you need them for door locks or other optional features.

monte_carlo97
11-16-2004, 08:51 AM
this thread is basically dead so i wll stray off topic.


you just need the wiring codes for your car...
if you have a GM car then you should get atleast 2 or the different codes from different places . cause gm likes to have wrong colors in each wiring code.

then get relays if you need them for door locks or other optional features.
ok what i got is power locks and windows. What realys would a ineed and how many. I new to this car alarm stuff

B@SSAN8OR
11-16-2004, 11:29 AM
well for some reason i get the idea your faken with me but i guess i will play along.


you need a DEI window module for power windows. and it depends on what kind of locks you have if you need the relay or not. check the wiring codes for the car

monte_carlo97
11-16-2004, 11:40 AM
well for some reason i get the idea your faken with me but i guess i will play along.


you need a DEI window module for power windows. and it depends on what kind of locks you have if you need the relay or not. check the wiring codes for the car
no dude, i am completely serious. I am completely new to car alarms. I would like to install one but never have.
Here is what i found though. Tell me what i need to do this besides the alarm.

Constant 12V+ Red Ignition Switch Harness
Starter Yellow Ignition Switch Harness
Ignition Pink Ignition Switch Harness
Ignition 2 Brown Ignition Switch Harness
Ignition 3 Purple Ignition Switch Harness
Accessory Orange Ignition Switch Harness (Heat/AC)
Tach White Ignition Module
Brake Switch White Brake Switch
Trunk Release Black (+) Switch
Trunk Pin Red/Black (-) Light in Trunk
Parking Lights Brown (+) Light Switch
Head Lamp Yellow (+) Light Switch
Door Trigger Dark Blue (-) Driver's Kick Panel 20 Pin Connector
Door Lock Light Blue Driver's Kick Panel 20 Pin Connector
Door Unlock White Positive Trigger
Horn Wire Black (-) Steering Column
Windows Up LF=Dark Blue, RF=Light Blue, LR=Dark Green, RR=Light Green
Windows Down LF=Brown, RF=Tan, LR=Purple, RR=Purple

ngsm13
11-16-2004, 12:42 PM
Hey B@SSAN8OR, hit me up on AIM: ngbd13 sometime. I REALLLY need help on installing an alarm, i've had it sitting around for over 6months cuz i don't know what to do exactly...thanx. peace

NG

BASS OUTLAW
11-16-2004, 02:06 PM
i didnt read the four pages, but my single 12" sub in sealed sound good with my Front stock speakers ( u can actually call them tweeters) but i will definitly upgrade when i get my Civic.

B@SSAN8OR
11-16-2004, 02:13 PM
here are some of the colors from design tech i think they are really accurate

http://www.designtech-intl.com/Content/techsupport/wirecolors/VehicleDetail?modelID=264

monte_carlo97
11-16-2004, 02:39 PM
ok so what do i need as far as relays and such. I going to get an alarm what else do i need.

B@SSAN8OR
11-16-2004, 02:52 PM
you might need relays for your door lock circuit since it is positive door locks. this might help you.

also check out the12volt (www.the12volt.com)

positive lock circuit (http://www.designtech-intl.com/Content/techsupport/documents/section04/note202.pdf)

monte_carlo97
11-16-2004, 06:31 PM
explain that postive and negative door lock **** to me cause i do not get it.

B@SSAN8OR
11-17-2004, 02:25 PM
this is the relay setup for a positive door lock system

http://www.the12volt.com/images/3wireposlocks.gif