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View Full Version : New box! Pair of 18 LMS ULTRAS



FISHKILLER
04-16-2014, 07:21 PM
Gonna try and squeeze a pair of these in the back of my ext cab truck. Built a T line for one little while ago, sounded great! Drawback was, box was huge!
I then built a 4 cubic foot sealed box. I enjoy the musicality of it but I do miss the overall output of my T line.
Decided I want more, and more power. I was powering my single with a pair of JL 1000/1 bi amping the dual 2 ohm voice coil sub.
I have since purchased a pair of DC 2k and plan on strapping to the pair of ultras.
I am leaning towards a ported box now. Thinking hard about some aeros. Finding I will most likely have a hard time fitting the diameter of aeros I will need for these subs. I need to know what size aero I should go with if I do single or pairs or three or whatever it takes for my space constraints.
Excited to build another box I have to say!
What is yalls suggestions for my Ultras on 2000 rms a piece??????? I listen to everything. Looking for the best sounding loud setup. I have about 10 cubes or so to play with.

hispls
04-16-2014, 08:20 PM
Those will displace a lot of air. I'd say you won't want to skimp on port and you'll need to tune very low to make them play flat. That in consideration the port it would take to tune that volume down low enough with adequate port area will probably not even fit in the box. My .02$ if you're not talking "wall" this isn't going to work well.

Alternately, I'm going to guess that you have deep pockets if you can afford a pair of LMS Ultras so why not spring for 3 or 4 18" passive radiators. If nobody makes them, build your own. I'd wager that if you're creative you can build them for around 80$ each. Passives will allow you to low tune and keep adequate radiating area without sacrificing your already inadequate box volume.

FISHKILLER
04-16-2014, 08:31 PM
You calling my WHAT inadequate?!?! HAHA, just playing.
Def don't wanna do a wall. I still throw stuff back there, gear for MX, few groceries....
You thinking lower tuning than 30? I think I can make a larger aero fit such as two tens or so. That is kinda where I want to go. Have not researched passive radiators at all. I know what they are and basically how they work but that's where it ends. I will read up.
Pockets not deep, no sir, I fish for a living, decent pay but very hard work. I just have a few passions. This is growing back into one. Bass head since I was 16, 41 now!
Back on track, yall think 10" aeros enough or touch larger?

FISHKILLER
04-17-2014, 08:25 AM
Been playing with the PSP calculator. Seems that ten inch ports are gonna be the max size I will be able to use in my space constraints given the port disp factored in. My subs have an Xmax of 33mm. Will a ten inch port be enough area for these? Be a total of two, one per sub.
I plan on firing my subs towards rear with port to the sides, up or possibly forward. Seems every time I try my subs facing forward I loose a bit of bass? Why is this when all the builds I see have them facing the front or up? Cant do up, need top of box for other things. I have four amps to mount in here also! Gonna do some rubber isolation type of things with amps on top of a heavily braced box.

FISHKILLER
04-17-2014, 11:37 AM
Yet another option for me is the non traditional subs firing down. Been searching this and found some decent info. It could work well for me due to the shape of box having a deeper measurement on bottom as it follows the angle of my front seats. Anyone have any recent first hand knowledge of larger down firing subs?

I have been firing rearward, have a piece of 3/4 mdf mounted under my carpet on back wall of truck that subs load into now. Seems the best response thus far in my rig. Down firing box would be new adventure for sure, just don't know if its worth it.

Lots of questions!

hispls
04-17-2014, 11:54 AM
Yet another option for me is the non traditional subs firing down. Been searching this and found some decent info. It could work well for me due to the shape of box having a deeper measurement on bottom as it follows the angle of my front seats. Anyone have any recent first hand knowledge of larger down firing subs?

I have been firing rearward, have a piece of 3/4 mdf mounted under my carpet on back wall of truck that subs load into now. Seems the best response thus far in my rig. Down firing box would be new adventure for sure, just don't know if its worth it.

Lots of questions!

If you're commercial fishing and not making big money you're in the wrong fleet, and there's work EVERYWHERE if you know your way around on the water and can work. Very good trade there if you don't mind busting your balls.

10" flared port per sub will probably do OK, and just going by the TC subs I've used before I'd say 30hz would be high but acceptable. You're dealing with a sub designed to play down below 20hz flat in movie sound effects in home theaters.

I've had good results down-firing subs. It's no different than loading them into a rear wall of a vehicle which also often works nicely. Keep enough clearance for the excursion and your only concern is possible suspension sag after a few years, though firing up would have the same risk. That risk is negligible considering the similar subs I've used but it's the only "downside" you'll see people discuss about down firing.

treesive
04-17-2014, 11:58 AM
Could probably get the box cut down better and tuned better using pr's instead of porting. Just a thought to be looked at to see if it works for you. One drawback is cost.

FISHKILLER
04-17-2014, 05:17 PM
I have yet to research PR. Gonna do that before I start box.
One thing I have done though is port my sealed box. I added four, four inch inside diameter pipes. Box volume after sub and ports is only 3.5 cubes. Ports are 34.75 inches each. This gives me a tuning of 32 hz according to PSP. I think it sounds great. Bass is extremely tight and accurate. OUtput is much better than my sealed box obviously and only lacking on my T line in the ultra lows. Overall I give it the nod over my T line because it sounds better on music to my ears.

My plan is to go for 4.5 cubes after disp of sub and port. Also gonna try to tune 2 hz lower using a ten inch port. The four inchers I used were actually four inches inside diameter, giving me a port area of 50 inches. I assume if I get my hands on a ten inch piece it will be more like 9.5 inches inside which is 70.8 inches. Hopefully this combined with the touch lower tuning will get a little of my low end output back. Don't get me wrong, lows were still great, flapping my wind shield wipers a little, and jarring my vision, was just not quite as much as my T line.

FISHKILLER
04-18-2014, 12:30 PM
I have now designed my box. Gonna be 9.8 cubes after port, sub and bracing. Ports will be 9 inches inside for a 63 inch port area. Ports are roughly 32 inches long. This gives me a 30 hz tune In a box size I can live with, leaving room to mount my 4 amps on top of box with out going above my window line and still can push seats all the way back with a regular incline on the back.
In process now of deadening rest of truck including roof which needed it bad with my single 18. Will not be taking out front seats and getting that part of floor but everything else is being covered.
This weekend I plan on making my ports, and adding two runs of 3/0 to my two additional batteries in bed. Was not planning on going this far but that's part of it!

hispls
04-18-2014, 12:36 PM
Also, why are we not seeing pictures of any of this?

FISHKILLER
04-18-2014, 10:33 PM
Dude. I know right! I am one of those dudes that can do most anything. Computers..........not so much! I have never posted a pic on any forum. I am an avid MX rider and have often wanted to post a pic or vid or whatever on those forums and never have!

Just got done stripping my interior, seats carpet and headliner out of truck. Went ahead and fully deadened truck. Roof, rear wall, ext cab doors, floor. Doors are mostly done previously, will touch them up when I go in to install new mids and highs.

Tomorrow Going to rain all day. Be a great day to build my ports. Hopefully I will have some breaks in rain to start on my runs of 3/0. Already have two runs of 1/0 going to add two runs of 3/0 and two batts also. Pretty jacked!

gckless
04-18-2014, 10:42 PM
Contact PSI for PR's. Mine have done great :)

bumpasauras
04-18-2014, 11:15 PM
Just bite the bullet break out the plasma cutter and do a blow thru won't have to worry bout nuthin after that lol. I seem to remember those subs doing better in sealed?? Prolly wrong

FISHKILLER
04-18-2014, 11:27 PM
Hearing ya on the blow through, threw, thru, how do you spell that?! Blow through, I believe.? My truck has very high mileage, I bought her new in 1997! Crazy. 287,xxx later and still going strong enough! SHort bed so cant do blow through due to precious cargo in the bed quite often (dirt bikes)! This is all basically just a study for me and my next truck. Gonna be a long bed of some sort and a definite blow through but still have room for stuff.
What is crazy to me is how different just closing my door sounds after dampening truck! I tried a little Press N seal, that's right. Also got a hold of two packs of dyna extreme, have to say the difference is retarded. After using the extreme then some press n seal back to back it feels like and sounds like rolling paper or something as non significant compared to the dynamat. I searched the press n seal after buying some just thought I would do my own side by side comparison. I will not purchase that again.

T3mpest
04-19-2014, 09:13 AM
Well look, he's building the box I told him to build the first time months ago, small ported box using aeros :P Just playing with you man. Anyway, yes you NEED pics, we wanna see. Other than that are you using 2 10 inch ports or one? I'd say 1 10 inch port is NOT sufficient, especially if unflared, 2 of them would be alright. I have a 21 which has less cone area than 2 18's (although more motor force) and it can easily compress a 10inch port at high volume levels..

FISHKILLER
04-19-2014, 11:41 AM
Two nine inch inside diameter ports. My tuning looks like it will be 29 Hz. Subtly changes in port length as I lower my tuning then higher box displacement with longer port, you know the quandary. A single 9 inch will give me 63 inches of port. Borderline but thinking it will suffice.


As far as the box building goes, I HAD to build a T line! Would have lost sleep otherwise.

Will work on some pictures.

FISHKILLER
04-19-2014, 12:00 PM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/510x287q90/843/o8gb.jpg
My first official posted picture ever. Funny. Gonna be firing away now, watch out!
This is my T line box under construction.

FISHKILLER
04-19-2014, 12:08 PM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/161x287q90/842/f0r9.jpg
SUb in T line

Hopefully yall can see these?

FISHKILLER
04-21-2014, 08:28 AM
Hey guys.
Few more questions. MY box size and shape is requiring me to run a nine inch aeroport. Needless to say a nine inch will have to be custom made. Not wanting to wait either to be honest, ready to get this all back together. This is my question, I can fit a pair of six inch ports fairly easy, per sub, but I need just a touch more area then they will provide. Two six inch will give me just under 57 inches of port area per sub. Adding a four inch to the equation would be just right giving me almost seventy inches of port area per sub.

How do I figure different size ports? All the calculators I have seen you have to use same size ports in multiple port configuration.
Also I am seeing a slight discrepancy between calculators. PSP and TORRES have been my ones of focus nut there numbers are a little off. ANy insight on this would be great guys. Planning on building box this week.

Rain got me all weekend, or most of it anyway, I did manage to stiffen, deaden and seal my Q logic kick panels and installed those with my ID XS 65 and 68. Today My plan is to do all my battery stuff and get rest of my panels back in my truck deadened and rattle free. Possibly start on doors for my other pair of ID mid and high.

Any help with the odd aero sizing would be awesome also some insight on the calculators as well. Yall have a great day!

Inferno333
04-21-2014, 08:20 PM
I would not mix sizes.

treesive
04-21-2014, 09:14 PM
Don't skimp on port area. The ultra will want it and you won't get the sound it is known for if it is choked

FISHKILLER
04-21-2014, 11:13 PM
I am trying not to skip on port area for sure. Would really like to add a 4 inch port to a pair of six inch ports. That would work out so nice for me. I just cant quite fit a ten incher in my area but two sixes and one four would be perfect for me. Just gotta figure out the tuning for different size ports.

Inferno, why you say no on the different sizes? If it is a no no on the different sizes I will figure something else out for sure.

Inferno333
04-22-2014, 12:11 AM
They will not pressurize the same. The 4" will be maxed out well before the 6" ones.

Personally, I'd rather run one driver in a perfect enclosure than run two with a suboptimal one.

treesive
04-22-2014, 05:13 AM
They will not pressurize the same. The 4" will be maxed out well before the 6" ones.

Personally, I'd rather run one driver in a perfect enclosure than run two with a suboptimal one.

Agree with this

FISHKILLER
04-22-2014, 07:08 AM
Ok that makes perfect sense about the odd size ports! I am going to use and optimal enclosure, at least that is my goal. I have been brain storming and think I may be able to get a ten inch port to work for me.

What about the issue of different port calculation sites coming up with a tad bit different tuning? Any insight on that?

Inferno333
04-22-2014, 09:31 PM
I've always used the calculator on the Precision Port website. Hasn't failed me yet.

T3mpest
04-22-2014, 09:48 PM
no box program is taking enough factors into account to en that accurate in the real world.. exper a 1hz deviation at least from your goal tuning.. its inaudible regardless.. you need port area though, especially if you tune low.anything above 25m/s in winisd is NOT A GOOD PORT if your tuning at 30hz or below... Can yoi fit passive radiators? sounds like that may be the way to go here.

FISHKILLER
04-23-2014, 08:51 AM
On the TC website it suggests several different box configurations for vented enclosures. One using 4 4" ports the other two using 6 4" ports. My box size falls in between there recommended small size box and medium size box. My plan now is to use 5 4" ports. Tuning to 30 hz I will be able to fit all ports inside box nicely. After sub, bracing, and port disp, I will be at 5 cubes per sub. WIll fit nicely in my space and give my ports a little more area to breathe on the outside of my box which I had worries about with a single large port. I will have at least 4 inches of clearance, maybe a touch more where ports are placed. Think it will work out nicely for me. Should start construction tomorrow.

FISHKILLER
04-23-2014, 10:29 PM
https://imageshack.com/i/n6ovsoj

---------- Post added at 10:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:29 PM ----------

https://imageshack.com/i/neeaxbj

FISHKILLER
04-24-2014, 07:03 AM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/510x287q90/834/ovso.jpg

FISHKILLER
04-24-2014, 07:04 AM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/510x287q90/842/eaxb.jpg

hispls
04-24-2014, 09:04 AM
I'd much rather use a single 8" port than try to mickey mouse with a bunch of smaller ones, particularly if they're going to be crowded together.

I think you'll be OK with 8" flared port per sub. Won't be optimum but by the time you had port turbulence you'd never notice because they'd be so loud, and when you're really pushing on the small side I find box volume > port area particularly for daily/music.

Silver-N-Black
04-24-2014, 09:28 AM
Nice sub's, box size and what are you going to tune it to?

FISHKILLER
04-24-2014, 10:11 AM
I was leaning that way HIGHSPLS. After many hours of research what is pushing me towards the multiple four inch ports is that is whats modeled on the TC SOUNDS enclosure recommendation. They have two sealed enclosures, three vented, and a couple PR set ups modeled. All vented enclosures use 4" ports as there baseline.
Funny thing is, before I read that on there website, I built a 4 cube sealed box, listened to it for a day or two, then decided to port it. I threw together four 4" inch ports and tuned it to 32 hz. That box sounded good! I was figuring if I added 12.5 more inches of port area with another port and also added a cube it would all sound even better. With my space constraint I really do not have enough unloading room or space for a single large port anyway. I think the multiple fours are gonna work better for me.
Obviously I have no issue building and trying boxes......so, if I build this box with five 4" ports and don't like it, I will just try another! I CAN NOT imagine having to pay someone to do all this for me! That would def price me out of the game!

FISHKILLER
04-24-2014, 10:12 AM
SIlver n black, thanks man! Are you referring to T line box in pics or new box I am getting ready to build? New box will be 10 cubes after subs, ports, and bracing. Tuning 30hz.

FISHKILLER
04-24-2014, 10:18 AM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/510x287q90/841/qwku.jpg
Adding two runs of 3/0

https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/161x287q90/836/ma5i.jpg
The right tool for the job!

Silver-N-Black
04-24-2014, 11:55 AM
SIlver n black, thanks man! Are you referring to T line box in pics or new box I am getting ready to build? New box will be 10 cubes after subs, ports, and bracing. Tuning 30hz.

I was referring to dual setup so 10cf? Reason was asking is i'm also going to run 2 18's TC5400. Just having a hard time on finding information, I have around 19cf.

FISHKILLER
04-24-2014, 04:25 PM
Yes, ten cubes after sub port and bracing disp. It is on the small side but you can go even smaller. Going to tune to 29 or 30.

Inferno333
04-24-2014, 07:11 PM
Are you using precision ports? I have a shameless sale plug if you are.

:)

Inferno333
04-24-2014, 07:12 PM
Are you using precision ports? I have a shameless sale plug if you are.

:)

FISHKILLER
04-24-2014, 09:19 PM
Not this time, no sir. If this box does not go as planned the next may have them! Plug away if ya like!

Inferno333
04-24-2014, 11:05 PM
Not this time, no sir. If this box does not go as planned the next may have them! Plug away if ya like!

No worries bud.

And the plug: I have 3x new dimpled 4" precision port kits sitting here that I'd like to sell.

FISHKILLER
04-25-2014, 03:59 PM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/70x70q90/c/834/7lzm.jpg
Flared and textured full length.

FISHKILLER
04-25-2014, 04:00 PM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/70x70q90/c/836/icz5.jpg
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/70x70q90/c/834/3bhq.jpg
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/70x70q90/c/843/e1s3.jpg

FISHKILLER
04-25-2014, 04:03 PM
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/70x70q90/c/843/e1s3.jpg

FISHKILLER
04-27-2014, 01:43 PM
Ok. Box is finished and powered in my truck. Will take some pictures today. So far I am more than pleased! Have a pair of DC 2k strapped powering them. Set gains with DD1 and infrasonic and crossover with my CC1. DUDE! WAY TOO LOUD! I can do decent hair tricks with both windows all the way down. Sounds awesome. VERY hard hitting and tight. I am very pleased thus far. By far the most I have ever heard so not much to compare it to. All I can say is wow.