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View Full Version : Sundown X-10 / X-15 / X-18 Prototypes Here



sundownz
12-10-2012, 11:32 AM
Just got them in and QC tested them all on the bench; very happy so far. Still need to get them fully charged then run preliminary specs (have to send them out to do so as our magnetizer isn't in yet) -- but we are still stiffening up the surrounds so those will only be ~80% accurate initially.

This is also the first look at our tooled 18" spider adapter piece !

On to the photos (video of the 18" is uploading) :

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6791.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6792.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6793.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6794.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6795.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6796.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6797.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6798.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6799.JPG

04murdalanche
12-10-2012, 11:33 AM
awwww sheeeeeeit

Jerhemy
12-10-2012, 11:34 AM
Looks great!! That 18" spider layout looks strong.

Can't wait to see some final prices and get a couple 12's!

av83
12-10-2012, 11:35 AM
Your new lines look insane, lol.

groundpound4200
12-10-2012, 11:36 AM
Any idea where pricing will end up?

ThatChevyGuy
12-10-2012, 11:39 AM
In for prices

skylineTT
12-10-2012, 11:43 AM
*Prices

sundownz
12-10-2012, 12:05 PM
Sundown X-18 Prototype First Look - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mmrp7VRRpx8)

First video of the X-18 up.

I've noticed some confusion about these testing videos; all of the drivers we test exhibit a similar sound at very high travel -- bit of a "whopping" sound is the best way to describe it. It's a combination of BL distortion (as we always push drivers well past linearity) , some mechanical (as drivers are a little noisy at high throw when not in boxes) , and also the camera mic itself doesn't do so well when that close to a driver creating that amplitude of sound.

Dtrom
12-10-2012, 01:22 PM
In for prices

x2

Timmy13091
12-10-2012, 01:25 PM
x2

x3

sundownz
12-10-2012, 03:22 PM
This is what I am coming up with on pricing for these drivers :

X-10 : $329
X-12 : $349
X-15 : $389
X-18 : $409

This is MAP from any authorized dealers (which is a shipped price). We will also have pre-order specials as these are launched; they may not launch all at once for reference. The pre-order price is TBA but will follow suit roughly at the same type of % discount as past pre-orders.

It is based entirely on their cost to build and I have not figured in a single cent for the money spent on the new tooling or patent fees.

QueSound15
12-10-2012, 10:32 PM
I want the 15 if it will be better than my 15" HDC3........haha silly thing to say

gckless
12-10-2012, 10:38 PM
I can't express in words how bad I want these RIGHT MEOW!

PapaGeno21
12-11-2012, 01:09 AM
Ok don't flame me here but is the X line better than the Z line?

I am loving the new Z V4 15"...

Phoenix Risen
12-11-2012, 01:12 AM
the z line is above the x line. these are 1krms iirc and the z is 1750.

gckless
12-11-2012, 01:40 AM
Jacob said before somewhere these are rated for 1250W RMS.

Phoenix Risen
12-11-2012, 01:44 AM
and there i stand corrected, i remember a while ago the x line was supposed to be a 1k... but we all know how that goes.

sundownz
12-11-2012, 07:59 AM
I got a bit more ambitious with the design -- I believe we'll see around 30-31mm of Klippel verified one-way linear travel from these as well... once I get the report back I'll post it up. A similar topology over-hung we did with a 15mm shorter coil Klippel tested at 24mm one-way and we have 7.5mm more over-hang so should measure out right at 30mm or so if all scales well :)

sundownz
12-11-2012, 01:19 PM
I am very excited about this line... a truly high excursion line at reasonable prices. I had a very particular vision with this line in mind -- I was not happy with simply making an evolutionary step from the SA line as our previous prototype from a few years back was. I wanted a fully new platform line to delivery truly GREAT performance. I think once the final specs are released and people see / hear these they will be a big hit.

Another cool thing about the X series motor is that it can be pretty easily re-coned with many popular 3" coils from custom sources such as FixMySpeaker in case someone tears one up and wants to go that route :) Many 8-layer flats will fit the gap.

sundownz
12-17-2012, 08:37 AM
The X-12s are out for magnetizing right now; haven't shipped the 10,15,18 yet so here are some pics of their depths :

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/depths/X-10.JPG
* X-10


http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/depths/X-15.JPG
* X-15

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/depths/X-18.JPG
* X-18

40oz
12-18-2012, 02:55 AM
What size enclosure do you anticipate the X-10 will require?

Dtrom
12-18-2012, 03:10 AM
Look beast.

Imtjnotu
12-18-2012, 03:21 AM
Anf what is the xmax

gckless
12-18-2012, 03:28 AM
Anf what is the xmax


I got a bit more ambitious with the design -- I believe we'll see around 30-31mm of Klippel verified one-way linear travel from these as well... once I get the report back I'll post it up. A similar topology over-hung we did with a 15mm shorter coil Klippel tested at 24mm one-way and we have 7.5mm more over-hang so should measure out right at 30mm or so if all scales well :)

Literally 6 posts up.

Imtjnotu
12-18-2012, 03:48 AM
Literally 6 posts up.

Looking for the exact

sundownz
12-18-2012, 08:00 AM
Until there is a Klippel report done I can give you several ratings of x-max that aren't as accurate; but will prefer to get the Klippel result for the "official" x-max figure on it :)

sundownz
12-18-2012, 08:01 AM
What size enclosure do you anticipate the X-10 will require?

You can go nearly as small as what the current models require; but not quite -- so as small as 1.25 or so. One of the benefits of having SO much mechanical capacity is that if your box needs to be bigger you won't hurt the driver -- you could go much larger without worry than the older designs.

jteske88
12-18-2012, 08:05 AM
When will i have the option to see a price! LOving how these look

Agoonygoblin
12-21-2012, 10:04 PM
Just got them in and QC tested them all on the bench; very happy so far. Still need to get them fully charged then run preliminary specs (have to send them out to do so as our magnetizer isn't in yet) -- but we are still stiffening up the surrounds so those will only be ~80% accurate initially.

This is also the first look at our tooled 18" spider adapter piece !

On to the photos (video of the 18" is uploading) :

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6791.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6792.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6793.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6794.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6795.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6796.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6797.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6798.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/CIMG6799.JPG

when will these be for sale?

gckless
12-21-2012, 10:24 PM
When will i have the option to see a price! LOving how these look

You have the option right now. You obviously didn't read the thread. See post #11 (http://www.caraudio.com/forums/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=11) in this thread.

Sub Woofin
12-21-2012, 10:31 PM
geezus!

gckless
12-21-2012, 11:05 PM
depending on the spiders 38-40+mm xmax.

Well I think we are getting at a whole different arguement here. 1.5k more RMS brings a lot of other things too. My main point was that yeah the subs are a bit more expensive, but the system overall to properly power it versus your 2.5kRMS is going to be much cheaper. But I think what you have to look at is the performance in its class. These should be at the top of the 1kRMS class based on what has been seen about them now, so a premium can be charged. He has also stated that manufacturing cost was higher on these.

Agoonygoblin
12-21-2012, 11:08 PM
Well I think we are getting at a whole different arguement here. 1.5k more RMS brings a lot of other things too. My main point was that yeah the subs are a bit more expensive, but the system overall to properly power it versus your 2.5kRMS is going to be much cheaper. But I think what you have to look at is the performance in its class. These should be at the top of the 1kRMS class based on what has been seen about them now, so a premium can be charged. He has also stated that manufacturing cost was higher on these.

Should i get one of these or wait for zv4 18

gckless
12-21-2012, 11:10 PM
Should i get one of these or wait for zv4 18

Probably start a different thread on it in the right section. But they are 2 different sized woofers, and will need different sized amps and electrical to power them properly, in short.

Agoonygoblin
12-21-2012, 11:12 PM
Probably start a different thread on it in the right section. But they are 2 different sized woofers, and will need different sized amps and electrical to power them properly, in short.

forgot to mention that it will be a aq2200d

sundownz
12-26-2012, 08:39 AM
Should i get one of these or wait for zv4 18

On an AQ-2200D I'd look at a Z v.4 -- you are closer to it's rated power that way.

sundownz
12-26-2012, 08:42 AM
Well I think we are getting at a whole different arguement here. 1.5k more RMS brings a lot of other things too. My main point was that yeah the subs are a bit more expensive, but the system overall to properly power it versus your 2.5kRMS is going to be much cheaper. But I think what you have to look at is the performance in its class. These should be at the top of the 1kRMS class based on what has been seen about them now, so a premium can be charged. He has also stated that manufacturing cost was higher on these.

What many folks don't understand is this (not you... but other folks) -- manufacturers can say all day long a sub has 40mm of x-max -- ask them for a Klippel or the math on how their surround is going to handle that without tearing.

An LMS-5400 Ultra 18 surround maxes out around 38mm or so.

These are no BS high displacement woofers -- suspension (surround AND spider) capacity that is incredibly high and class leading BL limited excursion in the 30mm+ range (soon to be Klippel verified).

Agoonygoblin
12-26-2012, 10:27 AM
On an AQ-2200D I'd look at a Z v.4 -- you are closer to it's rated power that way.

When are the zv4 coming out?

sundownz
12-26-2012, 10:29 AM
When are the zv4 coming out?

We haven't announced the ETA yet; but keep your eye on the Z v.4 thread for that information when available.

Trevor28139
12-28-2012, 02:50 AM
Pretty killer looking subs.

momax_powers
12-28-2012, 03:48 AM
what about the X-8

Bettr n' Revrse
12-28-2012, 03:56 AM
what about the X-8

Plenty about it on FB... Got delayed and wont be out for awhile

momax_powers
12-28-2012, 06:57 AM
****...i love me some "big azz'd" 8's

Bettr n' Revrse
12-28-2012, 07:02 AM
****...i love me some "big azz'd" 8's

I dont think Ill bother oerdering any... Already have way to many bigger 8's to mess with lol

sundownz
12-28-2012, 07:12 AM
As of now the X-8 is pending it's new surround tooling to be completed to have an actual prototype built ; the motor used on the "prototype" was an SA-12 motor and the X-8 will have it's own motor entirely as well.

Flastrongman
12-28-2012, 07:19 AM
I personally think the price point is reasonable on these subs seeing how there's not really anything to compare them with in the price range. Not to mention Sundown is an actual business not a charity service. Why would someone spend their valued time with r&d on new subs just to make peanuts?

momax_powers
12-28-2012, 07:56 AM
As of now the X-8 is pending it's new surround tooling to be completed to have an actual prototype built ; the motor used on the "prototype" was an SA-12 motor and the X-8 will have it's own motor entirely as well.

After the release of this x line and the upcoming zv4 line.... Will the next project be the second generation SAs (10"-15")and sa8v3:D

Or am i gettinh wayyyyyyy tooooo ahead of myself

sundownz
12-28-2012, 09:46 AM
After the release of this x line and the upcoming zv4 line.... Will the next project be the second generation SAs (10"-15")and sa8v3:D

Or am i gettinh wayyyyyyy tooooo ahead of myself

I am not working on an SA-8 v.3 at this time... but maybe to your other question :)

gckless
12-28-2012, 09:48 AM
I sure hope to see some NS's before another SA :)

Trevor28139
12-28-2012, 10:27 AM
Hate to jump off topic but while reading through this thread I noticed numerous deletions. What causes that just simply irrelevant posts or someone trolling.

sundownz
01-02-2013, 11:57 AM
Hate to jump off topic but while reading through this thread I noticed numerous deletions. What causes that just simply irrelevant posts or someone trolling.

Trolling.

---------- Post added at 11:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:57 AM ----------

I have a revised stiffer surround for the 10" frame in stock to test -- working on re-building an X-10 motor. As I don't have all of the new parts available in bulk yet this X-10 will get a Z v.4 coil and spider -- and I'll compare CMS to the Z v.4 10" I made. As CMS is the only figure I really need to know to figure out if the surround is stiff enough.

Here are a few pics of the X-10 soft parts and motor that haven't been show yet :

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/X-10_2nd_Surround/Coil_and_Cone.jpg
* Original parts; 60mm long 3" D4 coil

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/X-10_2nd_Surround/Soft_Parts_on_Driver.jpg
* Fun pic with parts upside-down on the motor and frame

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/X-10_2nd_Surround/Pole_Extension.jpg
* Very tall pole extension to keep the coil from smacking into the top plate when it leaves the gap (as the suspension allows that much throw) + the top plate has a small bevel on it as well as another safety measure. The tall pole extension also gives us more linear x-max.

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/X12/2012_Models/X-10_2nd_Surround/Frame_on_Motor.jpg
* Frame on the motor. One thing about the new motors with the tall extensions is that they won't work on "standard" frames as the pole extension would be too tall -- unless, of course, one machined customer spacers to get the basket higher. Other coils will work on the gap but other frames aren't practical to use (except other tall frames like the Ti style).

Guyver
01-02-2013, 12:17 PM
Are these SQL or SPL?

sundownz
01-02-2013, 12:29 PM
Stock format X series are SQL woofers.

Guyver
01-02-2013, 12:50 PM
Sweet! I'll be getting one soon then.

Flastrongman
01-02-2013, 01:39 PM
here's me now :yumyum:

here's me after my wife finds out I'm buying these :blackeye:

Thumpersplbassx
01-02-2013, 03:33 PM
The new line is looking great, can't wait until they're released!

sundownz
01-03-2013, 09:43 AM
FS is up around 5 Hz or so with the Z style spider and stiffer surround ; so I think that will get us where we need to be with these. I was happier with how it acted free air and on the specs.

So that means the X series will have a 4-layer spider and the Z series will have a 5-layer spider (previously NS stiffness) -- then the NS will have a 6-layer spider.

T.I.K.
01-03-2013, 10:13 AM
Unique subs, it's nice to see something fresh.

BassMechkanic
01-03-2013, 11:57 AM
Jacob are you getting your emails?

Andy
Pirate Customs
[email protected]

Falcons
01-03-2013, 12:23 PM
i still cant get over that surround. you could easily give a pair of these 3500 watts lol

sundownz
01-03-2013, 01:39 PM
Jacob are you getting your emails?

Andy
Pirate Customs
[email protected]

My "sundownz" account has no e-mails from that address.

BassMechkanic
01-03-2013, 01:58 PM
My "sundownz" account has no e-mails from that address.

sorry i sent from the [email protected]

i resent the email..... thanks when you get time.

GreekBrotha8
02-02-2013, 04:31 AM
My "sundownz" account has no e-mails from that address.

Ive been looking around for any kind of release date for these with no success..any ideas as to when they'll be available? Or for preorder? Reeeeeeeally want a 15!

sundownz
02-03-2013, 11:07 AM
Ive been looking around for any kind of release date for these with no success..any ideas as to when they'll be available? Or for preorder? Reeeeeeeally want a 15!

We haven't released the ETA yet ; stay tuned for it, though.

jasonbillnelson
02-03-2013, 11:10 AM
real sick!!!

gckless
02-03-2013, 11:38 AM
We haven't released the ETA yet ; stay tuned for it, though.

Do you plan on doing a pre-order on these? You said you probably won't on the Z's, but a pre-order on these may swing me this way over the Z's.

sundownz
02-03-2013, 11:42 AM
We are discussing what we want to do on pre-ordering on these -- announcements coming soon. There is the extended CNY holiday over-seas right now but I am working on developing my list of parts / complete woofers to produce... going to be a MASSIVE shipment between the X, Z v.4, new parts, and more of existing drivers and existing parts. Will have 1000s of the new parts in stock :)

thericanballer
02-03-2013, 12:07 PM
We are discussing what we want to do on pre-ordering on these -- announcements coming soon. There is the extended CNY holiday over-seas right now but I am working on developing my list of parts / complete woofers to produce... going to be a MASSIVE shipment between the X, Z v.4, new parts, and more of existing drivers and existing parts. Will have 1000s of the new parts in stock :)
But waiting is the worst part lol

Flastrongman
02-03-2013, 12:21 PM
We are discussing what we want to do on pre-ordering on these -- announcements coming soon. There is the extended CNY holiday over-seas right now but I am working on developing my list of parts / complete woofers to produce... going to be a MASSIVE shipment between the X, Z v.4, new parts, and more of existing drivers and existing parts. Will have 1000s of the new parts in stock :)

Have I told you lately that I love you? no homo

blobb454
02-03-2013, 09:21 PM
Wow these look like high quality subs! I like seeing the developing pics an assembly! How many man hours does it take to developer a new sub of this nature? The foam surrounds are freaking stout!! Yummy looking subs! And price is decent too.

brandonkain82
02-06-2013, 07:21 PM
It took me three hours to clean up the mess of drool I made from these **** beasts. The motors and surrounds are nasty. ITS LIKE MCDONALDS WITH THESESUBS.........IM LOVEN IT.....

GRPABT1
02-17-2013, 11:22 PM
Is there any klippel results for these subs yet? Specifically the X15? How well will they run off a genuine 1200watts RMS?

dragnix
02-17-2013, 11:33 PM
I want to know how it would do IB, still looking for a sub to do an IB setup with. This may be too beastly for such a task though lol

Bettr n' Revrse
02-18-2013, 04:41 AM
I want to know how it would do IB, still looking for a sub to do an IB setup with. This may be too beastly for such a task though lol

Not exactly what I would use for IB

sundownz
02-18-2013, 07:08 AM
Is there any klippel results for these subs yet? Specifically the X15? How well will they run off a genuine 1200watts RMS?

So far just on an early Z v.4 15" model from the new platforms; we'll be doing more Klippel tests soon.

---------- Post added at 07:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:08 AM ----------


Wow these look like high quality subs! I like seeing the developing pics an assembly! How many man hours does it take to developer a new sub of this nature? The foam surrounds are freaking stout!! Yummy looking subs! And price is decent too.

Counting the frame and soft parts it's been well over a year of time to get it all right.

dragnix
02-18-2013, 08:43 AM
Not exactly what I would use for IB

I know, but it would look pretty cool lol

tommydh
03-10-2013, 06:34 AM
So should I wait on ordering my extra sd-2's and just get 2 x-10's? I love the sd's but man these look sick Id really have a lil thump in the Mini's trunk

Spooney
03-10-2013, 09:30 AM
Im getting an x-15 or x-12. Thats just all there is to it .