Sundown 2012 Cones... At The Shop!

[sundownz]

One of each showed up for us to check out -- will be building a 12" up first since that is the largest one I have a full size spider for. So that means I can take a video of it tomorrow !

On to the photos... they turned out way crazier than I imagined.

18" Cone

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6637.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6638.JPG

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15" Cone

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6639.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6640.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6641.JPG

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12" Cone

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6642.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6643.JPG

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10" Cone

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6644.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6645.JPG

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6646.JPG

[ThatChevyGuy]

BEEF

its whats for dinner.

Love it! I've got to have two of those tens

[groundpound4200]

How long until we can get recones with these parts?

[Dtrom]

Helz yeah.

[hispls]

LOL It'll take some getting used to the look of those things.

[skylineTT]

Oh. My. God. That is exactly what I have been wanting for years.

[Ray21]

Holy crap! What sort of throw are these things looking to have?

[-BenBen-]

Those things are epic..I might switch to Sundown for them

[tCbass]

I must have the 12's!

[sundownz]

I saw some folks expressing concerns over the "SD" of the cones... here are a few photos :

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6668.JPG
* 10" Z v.3 Cone // 10" Z v.4 Cone

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6669.JPG
* 12" Z v.3 Cone // 12" Z v.4 Cone

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6670.JPG
* 12" Z v.3 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6671.JPG
* 12" Z v.4 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround
* Total SD difference is only 10%

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6672.JPG
* 10" Z v.3 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround

http://www.sundownaudio.com/misc/protos/New_Frames_2012/Cones/Cones_at_Shop/CIMG6673.JPG
* 10" Z v.4 Cone Diameter with 1/2 Surround
* The 10" frame is slightly over-sized... so it's actually slightly more SD

[Montana]

That half inch..

:wow:

[gckless]

Yeah, but what really matters is volume displaced, not necessarily cone area, which I'm sure is much higher with the extra Xmax. Do you have those figures yet?

[Bettr n' Revrse]

Not sure how I feel about them yet...

[BoomBoxStereo]

Why so odd looking?

[sundownz]

Why so odd looking?

http://www.caraudio.com/forums/sundown-audio/539809-sundown-new-2012-frames-parts-thread.html

Each surround has the following calculated geometric capacity :

10 -- 50mm one-way (frame allows 45)
12 -- 55mm one-way (frame allows 50)
15 -- 60mm one-way (frame allows 55)

----

In order to allow for such high throw they must be very large.

Bottom line -- almost no surround produced anywhere else allows this level of throw so these do look "odd" compared to what is generally available.

[VisceralSound]

http://www.caraudio.com/forums/sundown-audio/539809-sundown-new-2012-frames-parts-thread.html

Each surround has the following calculated geometric capacity :

10 -- 50mm one-way (frame allows 45)
12 -- 55mm one-way (frame allows 50)
15 -- 60mm one-way (frame allows 55)

----

In order to allow for such high throw they must be very large.

Bottom line -- almost no surround produced anywhere else allows this level of throw so these do look "odd" compared to what is generally available.
Email son

[Jes 42]

Exactly how a sub should look...lol

[sundownz]

Yeah, but what really matters is volume displaced, not necessarily cone area, which I'm sure is much higher with the extra Xmax. Do you have those figures yet?

On something like an average 12" surround you are looking at a geometric max of 27-35mm (31mm is a safe average) or so without damage compared to 58mm on our 12" surround (the 55mm figure is a more linear figure, but 58mm is geometric max).

So lets say 31mm x 1.0 (just a reference number) = 31 mm^3 of displacement x 2 = 62
Then 58mm x 0.9 (90% of SD) = 52.2 mm^3 of displacement x 2 = 104.4

Around 1.8 dB additional output when using the most of both. Even dropping to a more reasonable usage of, say, 40mm of travel...

40mm x 0.9 = 36 x 2 = 72 = 0.4 dB of additional output.

Doesn't take much to get a gain even with a bit of drop in SD :)

With all that being said -- theory only takes us so far and we've seen larger gains in output compared to theory in initial testing -- We have already made a "Hi-X" version of the Z v.3 12" model and have seen 1 dB gains on the meter vs stock models... a wider than average surround is used on them as well with an SD drop from stock cones -- and they don't gain nearly the throw.

Theory doesn't hold up as you also have the non-linearity of the surround coming into play as well as the spider... and we mate these big surrounds with much large, more linear spiders than the small surrounds -- so it's not all apples to apples in the whole driver package :)