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View Full Version : Need help with setting up Hybrid Audio Imagine



Nonten03
09-06-2012, 03:03 PM
Alright so i'm a little new at this and I have a few questions. I have a ROCKFORD FOSGATE T400-4 AMP that is going to be powering them.

Would I need a passive cross-over?

What all size cable you think I would need?

How Would I hookup My tweets?

Any help would be much appriected.

West
09-06-2012, 03:06 PM
What head unit are you using?

You could be able to run them active or passive depending on the deck and what you want to do.
Are you planning on having rear speakers as well or just the components?

You are gonna need some 16 or 14 gauge wire. How you install the tweeters depends on your vehicle (around ear level is best).

Nonten03
09-06-2012, 03:54 PM
There is going to be no rear speaker and i have 3 sundown 8 v.2 and a pioneer 80 psr. I don't really have enough knowlege yet to go active

zako
09-06-2012, 04:07 PM
There is going to be no rear speaker and i have 3 sundown 8 v.2 and a pioneer 80 psr. I don't really have enough knowlege yet to go active

It seems like you have all the ingredients to go active. The head unit is active capable in "network mode". Look up the documentation. In an active setup, you need two dedicated channels for the tweeters. You can run them off your RF amp or you can run them off the head unit amp. In either case, it's recommended to solder a capacitor in-line with the tweeter in order to protect the tweeter from destroying it by an accident by sending it a frequency that's too low. (Look up the value, I believe something like 20uF should be ok)

If you want to run passive, then the tweeter wire simply plugs into a connection on the back of woofer. There is no separate crossover box. This is suboptimal for SQ as the "crossover" on the back of the woofer was optimized to be used with coaxial configuration.

Nonten03
09-06-2012, 04:14 PM
It seems like you have all the ingredients to go active. The head unit is active capable in "network mode". Look up the documentation. In an active setup, you need two dedicated channels for the tweeters. You can run them off your RF amp or you can run them off the head unit amp. In either case, it's recommended to solder a capacitor in-line with the tweeter in order to protect the tweeter from destroying it by an accident by sending it a frequency that's too low. (Look up the value, I believe something like 20uF should be ok)

If you want to run passive, then the tweeter wire simply plugs into a connection on the back of woofer. There is no separate crossover box. This is suboptimal for SQ as the "crossover" on the back of the woofer was optimized to be used with coaxial configuration.

When you say "it's recommended to solder a capacitor in-line with the tweeter" I don't know what you mean lol and yes i know i got every thing for me to go active, but I'm a beginner and I got told just to start out passive.

quackhead
09-06-2012, 04:30 PM
There is going to be no rear speaker and i have 3 sundown 8 v.2 and a pioneer 80 psr. I don't really have enough knowlege yet to go active

it is all in the 80prs manual. It has time alignment, x-overs and a very nice eq section. Setting it up for 3 way active on the 3 sets of pre-outs will send highs to ch 1 L/R for tweets and mids (BP) output to ch 2 L/R on the RF. Then the 3rd set will go to the sub amp. The manual will identify which pre outs will be assigned which frequency ranges, as well as teach you how to use that sophisticated piece of equipment...next time you go take a ****, take the manual with you, it makes for some good reading material.

West
09-06-2012, 05:07 PM
If you go active you can have a lot more control over your system. The time alignment alone is a good reason to do it... You wouldn't need the passive crossovers at all. It would be worth while running an extra set of speaker wire to the location of the speakers just in case you wish to go active in the future. It will save you a bunch of time if you decide to switch.

DARKHART
09-06-2012, 05:20 PM
Seeing as how the Imagine's come already setup in coaxial mode, simply mount them as such and as time goes by and you gain the knowledge you need then venture into the active range. This way you can still enjoy your setup now and gain knowledge at the same time then you will also have a sound to reference from when you do go active. So you won't set it up wrong from the get go and then get turned off to the idea of going active.....just my 2 cents....

maylar
09-06-2012, 05:24 PM
When you say "it's recommended to solder a capacitor in-line with the tweeter" I don't know what you mean lol and yes i know i got every thing for me to go active, but I'm a beginner and I got told just to start out passive.

The Imagines come setup like coaxials, with a simple capacitor as a crossover for the tweets. The cap is mounted to the woofer. If you decide to mount the tweeter separately you have the option of wiring the tweet back to the woofer and using the built in cap, or using your own 2.2uF capacitor in series with the tweeter. It's that simple.

If you were to go active, the tweeter would be crossed over at 6000 Hz.

keep_hope_alive
09-06-2012, 05:48 PM
"going active" sounds more complicated than it is. With your equipment, I agree it is the right approach and it saves you from having to install a 2.2uF cap on the tweeters.

Simply wire from each speaker (tweeter or woofer) to the amp. Example:
Left tweeter in amp channel 1
Right tweeter on amp channel 2
Left woofer on amp channel 3
Right woofer on amp channel 4

From the HU, run a RCA pair from front/high out to channels 1&2 input. And run a RCA pair from rear/mid out to channels 3&4 input.

The front/high out will be setup in network mode for high pass crossover at 5kHz 18 dB/oct
The rear/mid out will be setup in network mode for band pass crossover at 80Hz 24dB/oct and 5kHz 18dB/oct


Running them in coaxial mode is a waste of equipment.
If you can't grasp these concepts, just ask for help from someone who does.

zako
09-06-2012, 06:08 PM
When you say "it's recommended to solder a capacitor in-line with the tweeter" I don't know what you mean lol and yes i know i got every thing for me to go active, but I'm a beginner and I got told just to start out passive.



Note that I am not saying to solder a capacitor to act as a high pass filter for blending with the mids. Your head unit already has an active crossover. However, you still _need_ a capacitor in line with the tweeter in order to protect the tweeter from being accidentally damaged by the amplifier. If a full range signal is accidentally sent to your tweeter, it can be destroyed. I am not 100% sure what's a good value for the capacitor. I believe 10-20uF should work. The 2.2uF capacitor that some people use with these tweeters is different. It acts as _the_ crossover when they don't have an active capable DSP. You don't need that because your head unit has the crossover in it. I am not 100% sure that's a good value for a capacitor that's merely used for tweeter protection. I have heard values between 10 and 20uF before. Lower is safer, but if you go too low, it will interfer with the actual crossover. For example, a 10uF cap creates a high pass filter with 6dB slope at 4,000Hz. This should be alright for the Imagine tweeter as the recommended crossover frequency is somewhere in 5-6.5KHz range, so the cap should not interfere with the actual crossover settings. A 13uF capacitor will create an HP filter at around 3000Hz. You can order it from parts-express.com or buy at a store like Radio Shack.

maylar
09-07-2012, 08:16 AM
The 2.2uF capacitor that some people use with these tweeters is different. It acts as _the_ crossover when they don't have an active capable DSP. You don't need that because your head unit has the crossover in it. I am not 100% sure that's a good value for a capacitor that's merely used for tweeter protection. I have heard values between 10 and 20uF before.

2.2uF is what HAT recommends for a 6kHz crossover. The implication is that the tweeter is not 4 ohms at that frequency.

Nonten03
09-07-2012, 01:52 PM
"going active" sounds more complicated than it is. With your equipment, I agree it is the right approach and it saves you from having to install a 2.2uF cap on the tweeters.

Simply wire from each speaker (tweeter or woofer) to the amp. Example:
Left tweeter in amp channel 1
Right tweeter on amp channel 2
Left woofer on amp channel 3
Right woofer on amp channel 4

From the HU, run a RCA pair from front/high out to channels 1&2 input. And run a RCA pair from rear/mid out to channels 3&4 input.

The front/high out will be setup in network mode for high pass crossover at 5kHz 18 dB/oct
The rear/mid out will be setup in network mode for band pass crossover at 80Hz 24dB/oct and 5kHz 18dB/oct


Running them in coaxial mode is a waste of equipment.
If you can't grasp these concepts, just ask for help from someone who does.

So if I do this will I be going active? and I order Cadence 14 AWG Gauge 15 Foot Blue Car Speaker Wire, True Gauge Wire

Cadence CTR124 12 Foot High Grade 4 Channel Twisted Pair RCA Cables, 100% Copper. Will this be enough for my front stage? Note: Wouldn't I need two 2 twisted RCA cable to go active?

keep_hope_alive
09-08-2012, 09:34 PM
yes, that is all "active" is.

The 4 channel RCA is fine for the front stage, but you will need 60ft or more of speaker wire. You need four runs of speaker wire to the front.