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av83
07-21-2012, 11:12 PM
I don't need to use screws to hold an enclosure together if I'm clamping it, do I? The glue is Titebond II.

Falcons
07-21-2012, 11:14 PM
If you do it correctly no. I use a nail gun with 1-1/4" brad nails just because it's cheap and easy.

jeremyg1
07-21-2012, 11:31 PM
I have built many enclosures with just glue and clamps...and they are doing just fine many years later.

the only real downside is the build time is increased quite a bit as you go through several glue/clamp/dry/repeat cycles....if you use brads or screws you can assemble the entire thing in one session.

hispls
07-21-2012, 11:38 PM
I always like to use mechanical fasteners as well as glue. Nail gun is easiest, screws do the job as well. Also take pics as you go.

k_schutte
07-21-2012, 11:47 PM
"NEED". no but it couldn't hurt. I use brad nails, glue and clamps. You just can't do better than a mechanical fastener, IMO...

RangerDangerV2
07-22-2012, 12:12 AM
3" lags.

av83
07-22-2012, 01:15 AM
I always like to use mechanical fasteners as well as glue. Nail gun is easiest, screws do the job as well. Also take pics as you go.

Pics coming soon. Keep in mind it's my 2nd attempt. Ever. My first one (built a few months back) was garbage, had to seal all sorts of gaps, but worked.

---------- Post added at 12:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:14 AM ----------


I always like to use mechanical fasteners as well as glue. Nail gun is easiest, screws do the job as well. Also take pics as you go.

Decided to go ahead and use screws. For ease, and peace of mind.

kushy_dreams
07-22-2012, 01:18 AM
make sure to predrill the holes and go 1 1/2 to 2inches in from the corners to avoid splitting

av83
07-22-2012, 01:22 AM
make sure to predrill the holes and go 1 1/2 to 2inches in from the corners to avoid splitting

Found that out after seeing all the bowed spots in my last one, lol.... But thanx, man.

Kangaroux
07-22-2012, 01:33 AM
Found that out after seeing all the bowed spots in my last one, lol.... But thanx, man.

For the record it doesn't happen if you use real plywood and not MDF :sneaky:

Julian
07-22-2012, 01:37 AM
Ply wood will still split lol.

There was a guy on SSA from Europe some years ago that did 100% screwless/nailless boxes.. they were nuts

av83
07-22-2012, 02:35 AM
Nothing like building an enclosure on your kitchen table at 1 in the morning, lol....

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120722_005004.jpg

First joint.

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120722_012620.jpg

We'll see how far I get tonight...

audiobaun
07-22-2012, 04:02 AM
It is better to Countersink for the screws, then come back with wood filler to cover and sand down to a smooth finish..:santa:Silicone the entire inside of every joint,and out what I like to do

av83
07-22-2012, 04:58 AM
Soooo. I seem to have lost the drill bit that I needed to pre-drill for the screws.... so what the he11? Lets go all glue.

Here are the sides being clamped.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120722_030720.jpg
and another view...
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120722_030900.jpg
I only have two clamps, so I went ahead put those going front/rear and placed 70 lb dumbells on top of a couple panels (what will be the top panel and one of the front baffles) to secure the sides to the bottom piece. This glue is fantastic, btw.. It says that you can remove clamps after 30 mins, but I went ahead and gave it 2 hours before removing them, after joining the rear panel and bottom. The joint was rock solid.

Here's a pic of the corner.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120722_030751.jpg
Cuts didn't turn out horrible for using my old sub box as a table to saw on, on the back porch. I just clamped a straight piece of wood to the panel i was cutting and positioned it as a guide for what ever cut I needed to make with my circular saw. Had to use a sanding block to smooth out a couple spots, but other than that, not shabby.

goingdef
07-22-2012, 05:10 AM
This is all titebond II as well no screws what so ever.
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x81/animalnut1310/P5260056.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x81/animalnut1310/P5310060.jpg

av83
07-22-2012, 05:18 AM
This is all titebond II as well no screws what so ever.


I **** you not, your enclosure was the inspiration for my current build lol. I read about it a while back, and am picking up the bedliner tomorrow, lol.

goingdef
07-22-2012, 05:30 AM
remember to lay down a couple cans of the cheapest flat black paint they have first so the mdf doesn't wick up the bedliner so much.

av83
07-22-2012, 05:45 PM
Port walls clamped.

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120722_163512.jpg

goingdef
07-22-2012, 05:46 PM
get er done!

pro-rabbit
07-22-2012, 06:25 PM
I **** you not, your enclosure was the inspiration for my current build lol. I read about it a while back, and am picking up the bedliner tomorrow, lol.

Bedlliner is not the way to go. There are other products that give you a better result then that and work with wood much better and require no prior or other color to be laid down first.

av83
07-22-2012, 06:32 PM
Bedlliner is not the way to go. There are other products that give you a better result then that and work with wood much better and require no prior or other color to be laid down first.

I saw your thread, as well, about the coating when looking at options. I ended up going with Black primer + RustOleum.com (http://www.rustoleum.com/CBGProduct.asp?pid=364)

wenn_du_weinst
07-22-2012, 06:43 PM
all I will say is there is a reason you see spl boxes with a screw every 1.5"

av83
07-22-2012, 06:49 PM
all I will say is there is a reason you see spl boxes with a screw every 1.5"

I would most certainly be using fasteners if this were for a higher powered system, but it's a single 15 that will never be hit with more than 1500 rms. Actually, I plan on tuning it to 1200. I know what my amp is, and don't want to push it. Plus, I don't compete. Or burp. Ever.

goingdef
07-22-2012, 06:54 PM
all I will say is there is a reason you see spl boxes with a screw every 1.5"

I would guess because they don't do a whole lot of wood working and are not aware of the fact that an adhesive bond is superior to a mechanical fastener in every way!

RangerDangerV2
07-22-2012, 06:55 PM
all I will say is there is a reason you see spl boxes with a screw every 1.5"

love the sig, lulz.

RangerDangerV2
07-22-2012, 06:55 PM
all I will say is there is a reason you see spl boxes with a screw every 1.5"

love the sig, lulz.

wenn_du_weinst
07-22-2012, 06:56 PM
I would guess because they don't do a whole lot of wood working and are not aware of the fact that an adhesive bond is superior to a mechanical fastener in every way!

no it would be the fact that a mechanical fastener acts as a stiffener, while the actual bond may be chemical and superior it does not extend past the surface as a screw will. Going for tenths on the meter the screws will give them the extra hundredth they may need.

---------- Post added at 05:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:56 PM ----------


love the sig, lulz.
thanks, I did just happen to notice my grammar error

Dirtrider4eva
07-22-2012, 06:59 PM
depends on power. if theyre long enough they can reduce flex. but think of this two.. the joint is going to be stronger than the wood itself with TB II

goingdef
07-22-2012, 07:02 PM
no it would be the fact that a mechanical fastener acts as a stiffener, while the actual bond may be chemical and superior it does not extend past the surface as a screw will. Going for tenths on the meter the screws will give them the extra hundredth they may need.

---------- Post added at 05:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:56 PM ----------


thanks, I did just happen to notice my grammar error

I bet everyone of those boxes would continue to pound if you pulled all there screws as well, a while back I made a box for a single T2 ten for a guy he didn't want to wait for me to glue it so he said just use screws and I'll glue it later needless to say it lasted minutes before the box was flapping and pulling out screws on just a test run! but it's what he wanted.

But on a note screws every 1.5" if applied before the glue had dried would make for a much better bond if you where building a massive box and didn't own a sh*t ton of clamps.

wenn_du_weinst
07-22-2012, 07:05 PM
they would still work, but they might also lose that .001db that the screws give. I am not suggesting that they need to be used or that glue isn't. I am just saying they do add strength even if at just a miniscule level. My boxes usually have screws just because I'm to impatient to clamp. I'll probably start nailing one of these days.

supermaxx123
07-22-2012, 07:11 PM
if you don't cut your wood very straight, screws do help quite a but. As for me, all glue for the most part.

goingdef
07-22-2012, 07:12 PM
yea they do speed up the build, but I still pull and fill before routing the edges if I use them but that's just to make sure the box last no hard edges to chip, but I have also never made boxes for comp use just daily drivers.

wenn_du_weinst
07-22-2012, 07:13 PM
the screws I use will self sink and actually pull the wood apart if I would back out.

goingdef
07-22-2012, 07:14 PM
if you don't cut your wood very straight, screws do help quite a but. As for me, all glue for the most part.

Thats when you cut a new piece and use a guide bar and some clamps or even screws to hold down the guide if you have too, then fill them later with tightbond and wood dust mix.

goingdef
07-22-2012, 07:16 PM
the screws I use will self sink and actually pull the wood apart if I would back out.

oh counter sunk bugle screws just below the top surface of the board?

wenn_du_weinst
07-22-2012, 07:17 PM
yeah, I also don't use mdf. If I try to back them out they will pull at least the top ply off. My next box will probably be mostly fiberglass so I won't have to worry.

double 07
07-22-2012, 07:40 PM
You wait until I see that carpenter that built my garage onto my house!!!!......I could have saved some money on fasteners and just glued & clamped it to my house.....LOL............Just kidding guys........I for one am an ole school builder and will always use screws in my enclosures.....

av83
07-22-2012, 08:04 PM
Thats when you cut a new piece and use a guide bar and some clamps or even screws to hold down the guide if you have too, then fill them later with tightbond and wood dust mix.

I clamped straight edges to the wood as a guide before every cut. I don't have a lick of carpentry experience. Not even shop class in school. But it just seemed like common sense to do so. Btw, cutting 45's for the first time in my life right now... Not hard except for when I drooped my first cut and dented the 45 degree edge so bad that I had to start over, lol...

goingdef
07-22-2012, 08:15 PM
I clamped straight edges to the wood as a guide before every cut. I don't have a lick of carpentry experience. Not even shop class in school. But it just seemed like common sense to do so. Btw, cutting 45's for the first time in my life right now... Not hard except for when I drooped my first cut and dented the 45 degree edge so bad that I had to start over, lol...

If you have no help use a table or saw horse set to catch your drop pieces, keep both hands on the saw pressing over towards the guide and down/forward with steady low pressure.

av83
07-23-2012, 01:44 AM
So I just put my port walls in. I had glued them together using 90 degree clamp, and then after that dried, clamped in the 45 that goes on the corner. Set in the enclosure on the titebond, placed 100 lbs of iron on top to clamp it down.... and then, well after it was too late to fix, measured the port. The back port wall is a hair under 1/8 of an inch over the 4 inches it's supposed to be away from the rear panel. The other, longer, port wall is exactly right. 4 inches. So I have 11 inches of port wall a tad off, and 14 inches that's perfect. I don't think there's any going back, either. How bad is the damage here... anyone know? Other than that, its going well. Just SLOW, lol.

goingdef
07-23-2012, 01:51 AM
I don't think it will make any difference at all really what are you saying it's off by 3/32 of an inch?

av83
07-23-2012, 01:55 AM
I don't think it will make any difference at all really what are you saying it's off by 3/32 of an inch?

pretty much exactly that. for eleven inches.

goingdef
07-23-2012, 01:58 AM
I just don't think your going to experience anything negative from it.

av83
07-23-2012, 02:00 AM
Almost done. Just have to cut out holes in the front baffles and put the top panel on.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120723_004747.jpg

The section of the port that's a tiny bit off. My only real mistake so far.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120723_004821.jpg


I just don't think your going to experience anything negative from it.
Hope so. Thanks for the feedback in this thread, too.

goingdef
07-23-2012, 02:09 AM
looks good just remember to wait the full setup time on the glue before you power it up, looks like you should be done in the next 2hrs or so max.

av83
07-23-2012, 02:15 AM
looks good just remember to wait the full setup time on the glue before you power it up, looks like you should be done in the next 2hrs or so max.

It'll be a few days before it's making noise, so no problem there. And I won't be doing anymore tonight. Gotta work tomorrow. I'll finish it tomorrow evening, and post the result for ya.

goingdef
07-23-2012, 02:18 AM
It'll be a few days before it's making noise, so no problem there. And I won't be doing anymore tonight. Gotta work tomorrow. I'll finish it tomorrow evening, and post the result for ya.

sounds good man can't wait to see the finished product.

av83
07-24-2012, 05:25 PM
Almost there.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/580824_2315866992776_1519253920_n.jpg
Front baffle is clamped now, and drying. 2nd baffle, paint, then done.

goingdef
07-24-2012, 05:29 PM
looks good man ask around and see if you know anyone with a router and a 1/4 round bit and go around all hard edges before you paint it.

av83
07-24-2012, 10:59 PM
looks good man ask around and see if you know anyone with a router and a 1/4 round bit and go around all hard edges before you paint it.

Actually, I have a pretty nice router. Used it for my hole cuts in the baffles. Had to use it for the sub and port cut out, since my jigsaw took a crap on me. I have a decent circular, drill, and router.... just no proper work space, lol. Anyway, I like the sharp edges, and will be sanding them to perfection tomorrow. Then painting.

goingdef
07-24-2012, 11:04 PM
Actually, I have a pretty nice router. Used it for my hole cuts in the baffles. Had to use it for the sub and port cut out, since my jigsaw took a crap on me. I have a decent circular, drill, and router.... just no proper work space, lol. Anyway, I like the sharp edges, and will be sanding them to perfection tomorrow. Then painting.

oh if you want to keep the hard lines I would at least take the corners to round, have you ever seen the corner of a box someone sat down to hard and it just breaks/tears it up leaving it looking like layers of bunched paper.

av83
07-25-2012, 01:53 AM
oh if you want to keep the hard lines I would at least take the corners to round, have you ever seen the corner of a box someone sat down to hard and it just breaks/tears it up leaving it looking like layers of bunched paper.

That's a good idea. What about corner covers, like on the outside of PA speakers? I honestly just don't feel like going out and buying the router bit just for that. Those things are fairly pricey for something I'll probably use once every 5 years, lol. I'll figure it out tomorrow before I paint it. The box is completely assembled, now. I just finished the 2nd baffle on the front. It's clamped and has about 150 lbs of metal weights on it. I'll post pics tomorrow after it dries. I still need to sand down the port holes that are cut into the baffles (so that they are flush with the port), but other than that, its looking decent.

goingdef
07-25-2012, 02:10 AM
It looks great man and awesome idea on the corner protectors!

hispls
07-25-2012, 02:10 AM
Rounding over sharp edges on box generally gains DEEBEEZ. Definitely worth doing around the opening of the port, and if your sub will flush mount you should round over around the outside of where the sub mounts.

Of course even an entry level roundover bit is like 20$ so probably not the best investment.

Box looks good by the way.

I don't see that much difference in the port making an audible difference either.

av83
07-25-2012, 02:21 AM
Thank, guys. The feedback is much appreciated. And I appreciate the kudos as well. Ive taken my time and tried my best to do it right. It's very rewarding to see all of the time ive been putting into it, paying off.

av83
07-25-2012, 02:26 AM
I don't see that much difference in the port making an audible difference either.

Ram and goingdef told me the same thing. Was glad to hear it.

av83
07-26-2012, 02:46 AM
Well, other than a lil router bites in the speaker holes, it's turned out decent. I'll spend tomorrow priming and painting. Not bad considering what I was working with. ...3 power tools, and a hand sanding block + about 30 sandpaper changes, and some clamps/dumbbells, lol. On a crappy old kitchen table. The weight + another one you can't see are holding down the last two 45's while the glue drys.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120726_012050.jpg

I'm especially loving how the port turned out. Can't make it any thing other than straight, so I made it as pretty as possible. I'll put a layer of primer, than gloss black, down it the best I can tomorrow. I meant to do that while it was still open, lol.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120726_011804.jpg

goingdef
07-26-2012, 02:55 AM
looks great man! little tip after you mark and drill the holes for mounting the sub especially since your only going thru 3/4 of material take the thinnest super glue you can find and feed it into the holes it makes the material almost impossible to strip out! I actually think if I had set the clutch on my drill any tighter it would have sheared off the screws. If you don't do it now remember it for later down the road super thin ca!

audiobaun
07-26-2012, 03:46 AM
Well, other than a lil router bites in the speaker holes, it's turned out decent. I'll spend tomorrow priming and painting. Not bad considering what I was working with. ...3 power tools, and a hand sanding block + about 30 sandpaper changes, and some clamps/dumbbells, lol. On a crappy old kitchen table. The weight + another one you can't see are holding down the last two 45's while the glue drys.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120726_012050.jpg

I'm especially loving how the port turned out. Can't make it any thing other than straight, so I made it as pretty as possible. I'll put a layer of primer, than gloss black, down it the best I can tomorrow. I meant to do that while it was still open, lol.
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120726_011804.jpg

That box looks absolutely fantastic man!! Nice job! Cant wait to see the Finished Product!:naughty:

av83
07-26-2012, 03:48 AM
looks great man! little tip after you mark and drill the holes for mounting the sub especially since your only going thru 3/4 of material take the thinnest super glue you can find and feed it into the holes it makes the material almost impossible to strip out! I actually think if I had set the clutch on my drill any tighter it would have sheared off the screws. If you don't do it now remember it for later down the road super thin ca!

Thats a pretty dang good idea. I am using #10 (http://www.caraudio.com/forums/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=10) wood screws and washers to hold the sub in. I'll pilot the holes, and fill em with super glue prior.

goingdef
07-26-2012, 03:56 AM
Thats a pretty dang good idea. I am using #10 (http://www.caraudio.com/forums/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=10) wood screws and washers to hold the sub in. I'll pilot the holes, and fill em with super glue prior.

thread them in at least once before adding the glue, you really wouldn't believe how hard the material gets and use a brand new bit to drive them making sure to match the bit to the screw don't try a #2 (http://www.caraudio.com/forums/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=2) bit on a #3 (http://www.caraudio.com/forums/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=3) screw it will strip the head going in after the glue solidifies the material. Sorry to run on but I'm just giving you all the advice I can think of from the many boxes I have built or fixed and the issue's I ran into along the way.

av83
07-26-2012, 07:41 PM
That box looks absolutely fantastic man!! Nice job! Cant wait to see the Finished Product!:naughty:

Thank you, sir.

av83
07-26-2012, 07:46 PM
remember to lay down a couple cans of the cheapest flat black paint they have first so the mdf doesn't wick up the bed-liner so much.

I used primer to try and prevent this. Two coats, and it still sukked up the first coat of rubberized stuff like it was nothing. Imma have to go to Autozone again. And I'm going to get better stuff while I'm at it.

av83
07-27-2012, 08:23 PM
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/hh599/adamviele/IMG_20120727_180041.jpg
Done! Its in the car now and sounds amazing. The rubberized coating is kinda meh looking, but after four cans, I'm done buying the stuff, lol. Shoutout to Buck ; for the great design! And thanks again to hispls ; for a fantastic sub!

goingdef
07-27-2012, 08:31 PM
I used primer to try and prevent this. Two coats, and it still sukked up the first coat of rubberized stuff like it was nothing. Imma have to go to Autozone again. And I'm going to get better stuff while I'm at it.

you notice I said cans not coats!:laugh: I put down about 10 coats before using the spray on bedliner. but it still looks good man!

mazdakid
07-27-2012, 08:41 PM
Ah i remember my shocker super extreme 18. Had it 10 years ago when i was 18 and played it for about 10 minutes on a fosgate 250.2 and fried the sub lol. Had the extreme and shocker 2's before that.

hispls
07-28-2012, 12:48 AM
Box looks really good. I don't have anywhere near the patience for that sort of result.

That sub models well in that box, I'm sure it does really nicely.

Kangaroux
07-28-2012, 12:51 AM
Box looks really good. I don't have anywhere near the patience for that sort of result.

That sub models well in that box, I'm sure it does really nicely.

Especially when it comes to vacuuming ;)

Boomsday
07-28-2012, 12:57 AM
I havent used a screw in the past 5-7 boxes I have built for myself and others, I have lots of clamps and Im very patient, and I have 2 xfire xsv2's on 5k daily, and the box is as solid as could be..Gonna be building a new box in a few days with no screws again..They have there place just not in my boxes

05fronty
07-29-2012, 08:47 AM
i use both

West
09-21-2012, 01:06 AM
Good read!
and a job well done.

Chriszle
09-21-2012, 01:45 AM
No screws in my box, and it is holding up fine over the last year.

av83
09-21-2012, 02:41 AM
Good read!
and a job well done.

Thanks! And it was fun even though it took me several days to build something most would use screws to do in a couple hours. I will never ever get rid of this box, man. No one could pay me enough to cover all the man hours that went into it. especially after cutting the port opening in the baffle too big on purpose, just so I could hand sand it to match the rest off the port perfectly. It sounds amazing on everything I play , too.

av83
09-21-2012, 02:43 AM
No screws in my box, and it is holding up fine over the last year.

Good to know it'll last. I was liberal with the glue and the cure time, so hopefully that helps too.

West
09-21-2012, 02:49 AM
Thanks! And it was fun even though it took me several days to build something most would use screws to do in a couple hours. I will never ever get rid of this box, man. No one could pay me enough to cover all the man hours that went into it. especially after cutting the port opening in the baffle too big on purpose, just so I could hand sand it to match the rest off the port perfectly. It sounds amazing on everything I play , too.

I can't blame you, somethings are worth more than money...

CAT MAN
10-16-2012, 02:00 AM
good job man

Montana
10-16-2012, 02:11 AM
Cat-Man stalking in progress.


Looks good, clean box! Kudos!

av83
10-16-2012, 02:17 AM
Cat-Man stalking in progress.


Looks good, clean box! Kudos!


good job man

Thanks! I appreciate it. ..Wasn't easy sanding by hand, and making cuts on a kitchen table, lol. But it was worth it.