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View Full Version : Benefits of a T-line Enclsosure



itsblown
04-14-2012, 08:18 PM
Just wondering what are the benefits of a t line enclosure over a ported enclosure.

I understand that T-lines are absolutely Massive boxes but do they increase output and do they have a flat freq response. Also how are they for daily use and musically.

itsblown
04-14-2012, 08:38 PM
Also are there any programs out there where I can model what each kind of an enclosure will do. Kind of like what pete on his hexi bass channel is talking about. he is probably making things seem way more complicated than what they really are but is there a program out there like that?

wenn_du_weinst
04-14-2012, 08:40 PM
They have a large wide bandwidth. They are SQ boxes, they can get louder then a poorly designed ported box but won't get louder then a properly built ported enclosure.

itsblown
04-14-2012, 08:45 PM
hmm I know it depends on the sub. But even for efficiency. Like I was hoping to save some money by only running 1 sub I was looking into a fi ssd 12. Now one of those in a properly built T line vs one in a properly built Ported enclosure. The t line would give me a flatter response and a better bandwith while the Ported would give me a louder response? am I summing that up right?

wenn_du_weinst
04-14-2012, 08:53 PM
Pretty much, cabin has a lot to do with it, but as a generalization yes.

wenn_du_weinst
04-14-2012, 09:01 PM
Now I will have to add before some one else says it;
A tline may sound louder to the ear as it will be louder over a larger area, while the ported enclosure will be more peaky.
If you want to design tlines and horns you need to download hornresp (or other similar) but get ready to read up on the instructions. It is about as user friendly as building your own rocket.

itsblown
04-15-2012, 12:29 AM
Now I will have to add before some one else says it;
A tline may sound louder to the ear as it will be louder over a larger area, while the ported enclosure will be more peaky.
If you want to design tlines and horns you need to download hornresp (or other similar) but get ready to read up on the instructions. It is about as user friendly as building your own rocket.

that is always re assuring to hear:graduate: Ill have to take a look at it tonight.. Now I know I have asked you this before as a response to one of your threads, but what program do you use for modeling different sub woofers and seeing the peek and such on a graph. Not to nut hug bute pete or hexi bass on youtube how does he go about determining which enclosure would give the most desired output. or what program is he using

Moble Enclosurs
04-17-2012, 01:33 AM
They have a large wide bandwidth. They are SQ boxes, they can get louder then a poorly designed ported box but won't get louder then a properly built ported enclosure.

This is very true if you are limited on certain factors, such as space. Do not think that "tline" is above a conventional design, just because it uses different design paths. The design type you use will be based on the vehicle and you, not the other way around. But as far as the response curve flattness is concerned, that is driver specific and some subs may work better in conventional ported designs for that reason...given those mentioned limitations exist again. But generally, due to the way the tline is figured (properly), it can be one of the most powerful design styles available. There are many different types of tlines though, and then it would be figuring which kind of tline will be the best fit, not just a tline in general. The option to control the response with certain physical changes within the design style is the main plus from that of a conventional BR design.

BUT, the main difference is not the phsyics, but the acoustics (and not referring to efficiency, as mentioned, a proper conventional BR can be just as efficient). I am referring to the output type: Compression or intensity. It can get detailed, but he differences can be the defining factor in transient response for musicality over SPL and vice versa. In a tline (of all forms) you tend to have more options to use for designing.

18leu
04-17-2012, 02:48 PM
hy can i get some help for a t line box for a civic coupe 95 on a alpine r10 4+4
please help me

sobe3yourself.
04-17-2012, 02:50 PM
my (2) 6.5" tang bands get louder on 100 watts a piece than my friends (2) 12" almani subs on "1700 wattz maxxx"

wenn_du_weinst
04-17-2012, 03:10 PM
that is always re assuring to hear:graduate: Ill have to take a look at it tonight.. Now I know I have asked you this before as a response to one of your threads, but what program do you use for modeling different sub woofers and seeing the peek and such on a graph. Not to nut hug bute pete or hexi bass on youtube how does he go about determining which enclosure would give the most desired output. or what program is he using
I use a mixture of different things most is based on what I know about my own car though. PWK built his own program around an algorithm he wrote a while ago.

ace_800
04-17-2012, 03:15 PM
My Trubass 8" gets louder off my xtant(220rms or so) than my 10" Massive CW10 did off a kicker ZX400.1. The trubass is in a tline, the massive was in a properly ported box.

wenn_du_weinst
04-17-2012, 03:17 PM
My Trubass 8" gets louder off my xtant(220rms or so) than my 10" Massive CW10 did off a kicker ZX400.1. The trubass is in a tline, the massive was in a properly ported box.
no it wasn't.

ace_800
04-17-2012, 03:24 PM
Yeah it was, specs were from massive. Kind of hard to mess up something that is roughly 1.2^3 before displacement with an aeroport. Pretty basic.

wenn_du_weinst
04-17-2012, 03:27 PM
Yeah it was, specs were from massive. Kind of hard to mess up something that is roughly 1.2^3 before displacement with an aeroport. Pretty basic.

That right there proves my point. There is now way a ''one size fits all'' design from the manufacture is going to be optimal in your car. Meaning you didn't have the best box you could get for the 10''

ace_800
04-17-2012, 03:39 PM
That right there proves my point. There is now way a ''one size fits all'' design from the manufacture is going to be optimal in your car. Meaning you didn't have the best box you could get for the 10''

True, I'll give you that.

18leu
04-18-2012, 12:00 PM
some help please'??

Moble Enclosurs
04-18-2012, 03:29 PM
some help please'??

I can help you out if you want to purchase a design. What kind of help are you looking for? :D

18leu
04-19-2012, 11:45 AM
some dimensions for a t line for a alpine r 10 1043d :D thanx

itsblown
04-19-2012, 08:02 PM
That right there proves my point. There is now way a ''one size fits all'' design from the manufacture is going to be optimal in your car. Meaning you didn't have the best box you could get for the 10''
So how do you find out whats optimal for your car?
Thinking of designing a Tline for a sa-8 v.2

Moble Enclosurs
04-20-2012, 02:27 AM
some dimensions for a t line for a alpine r 10 1043d :D thanx

Send me an email and Ill see if I can get you some basic info. email is in sig

Moble Enclosurs
04-20-2012, 02:29 AM
So how do you find out whats optimal for your car?
Thinking of designing a Tline for a sa-8 v.2

It takes a while if done correctly. Explaining it can take a while as well. If I can remember when I have more time, Ill jump in and explain a bit......if I remember. :D

I will note that tlines for the sa8s are a great idea.

itsblown
04-20-2012, 09:16 AM
It takes a while if done correctly. Explaining it can take a while as well. If I can remember when I have more time, Ill jump in and explain a bit......if I remember. :D

I will note that tlines for the sa8s are a great idea.

Thats what I like to hear :) I just really want to know the science/math that goes behind determining what box is best for your desired output which in this case is loud and flat.

Buck
04-20-2012, 10:51 AM
Now I will have to add before some one else says it;
A tline may sound louder to the ear as it will be louder over a larger area, while the ported enclosure will be more peaky.
If you want to design tlines and horns you need to download hornresp (or other similar) but get ready to read up on the instructions. It is about as user friendly as building your own rocket.

Hornsrep is vet difficult to learn.

Bettr n' Revrse
04-20-2012, 11:04 AM
I was considering a different type box for my next setup too since I will be running on limited power...

Moble Enclosurs
04-20-2012, 12:04 PM
Hornsrep is vet difficult to learn.

It also does not give you everything you need to know yet..still. But yea, in order to learn the physics and acoustics behind it (and I mean comfortably and extensively), it can take a while if you have the time and the right information. Dont rely as much on others opinions as you should your own experiences also, because every design is different. There are constants, but you then have to know what they are and how those constants even effect every other variable. Very very complex if you want to do it more accurately than just an, "I am tuning it to 33Hz, and making the volume 2.5 cubic ft and placing the subs up and port back" (example of course).

Bettr n' Revrse
04-20-2012, 12:06 PM
Id really like to learn how to design...

BaSsLoVeR2012
04-20-2012, 12:22 PM
Now I will have to add before some one else says it;
A tline may sound louder to the ear as it will be louder over a larger area, while the ported enclosure will be more peaky.
If you want to design tlines and horns you need to download hornresp (or other similar) but get ready to read up on the instructions. It is about as user friendly as building your own rocket.

I defiantly agree it takes some correct cutting skillz and lots of reading, I personally like a well designed ported enclosure.

itsblown
04-20-2012, 04:07 PM
I just want to know how people determine what size enclosure for what size sub in what vehicle I know it probably has something to to do with the car and cabin geometry of the car but Is it just a guessing game or is there math behind it when people say this box is the right box for my car vs the manufacturers suggestions

Moble Enclosurs
04-20-2012, 05:20 PM
I assure you it is no guesswork :D

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/1213/screenshot20120420at418.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/18/screenshot20120420at418.png/)

http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/4263/screenshot20120420at413.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/163/screenshot20120420at413.png/)
http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/4263/screenshot20120420at413.png (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/836/screenshot20120420at413.png/)

slim2fattycake
04-20-2012, 05:31 PM
No one can tell you what is optimal. They "think" it is.

Moble Enclosurs
04-20-2012, 06:59 PM
No one can tell you what is optimal. They "think" it is.

Optimal is a relative term still. It does not mean perfect. You cannot confuse the two. With all of the correct details and known limitations, it is very possible to find what may work the best for any setup..again depending on what preferences are given by the constants and by the customer. What I will say is, there can be multiple layouts that can be utilized in a given "optimum" setup, so that is usually the reasoning that an ever-going search will always be active on figuring out what will work the best.
SO, for instance if you get a design figured for you vehicle using a specific set of equipment, and it works just fine for you, then down the road you get another for the same system, it is possible that the designs may look completely different. BUT, the performance is what is optimized, not the looks (less important). SO, two different design ideas may be able to perform the same way, with little errors or differences that may be audible or not, or measured or not. BUT, optimized ideas are possible being that there will always be a huge leeway or variable in the solution of a system. And that variable is the relative part of the whole idea. That variable can be any given parameter of dimension, or any physical or acoustical or psychoacoustic factor of the design regardless other variables remain the same.

Its all in how you make it work that makes it as optimized as possible for that given idea. But, it can be agreed that no one can tell you what is perfect, because perfection is not a probability in sound due to so many differences in each environment and piece of equipment. The thing that remains separate from perfection are those differences and how strong of an effect they have on what is being figured.

slim2fattycake
04-20-2012, 07:06 PM
optimal is a relative term and i didn't mean perfect.