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dmoney68m8
01-17-2012, 11:15 PM
well let me start off by saying i like to listen to rap music, i like hard hittting bass but i also like it to sound good.
i guess what i would like to know is if it would be beneficial for the sq considering the type of music i like to listen to if i were to have a large rear stage with many lows and mids and highs increase towards the front stage
like this for example:trunk 2 12's rear deck 6x9 coaxial rear kick panel 2 8's front kicks 6'5
s front door 5.25's front door tweeters on axis front apillars tweeters on axis
as oppose to having almost completely no rear stage which i've heard is better for sq
for example: trunk 2 12's front kick 6.5's front door 5.25's front door tweeters on axis(maybe maybe not) front apillars tweeters on axis
i know what sounds good to one person may sound like sh*t to another person but if you listened to the music i did which would you prefer?

dmoney68m8
01-17-2012, 11:18 PM
the reason i am posting this is i am very unhappy with my current system which if you look at my galllery i'm sure you'll see why and i would like to figure out exactly what i am going to try to do with it
p.s. i apologize if this is the wrong thread for this type of discussion if necessary i will move to another thread

Why So Cereal?
01-18-2012, 01:00 AM
What exactly is it that you do not like about your system?

Either way, I dont see a need for that many speakers in your car (in your examples). But, maybe thats just me. The way I look at rear fill is: if your not in it for all out SQ with staging, imaging, blah blah; then, you can run rears to the point where it sounds good to you. But if youre trying to have an accurate stage, the rear fill will need to be properly implemented (time alignment, bandpass....) I say start out with a nice set of comps up front in properly sealed and deadened doors with your subs and see if your satisfied or if something feels...."empty" behind you. Then, go from there. Remember SQ is all about that accurate front stage, so focus on this the most and just use the rear fill to complement it.
Hope I helped :)

stocker08
01-18-2012, 02:00 AM
That is probably way too many speakers. More than necessary at least. You would benefit way more by purchasing one nice pair of components and give them ample power. A well powered set of comps can be more than loud enough if installed and powered correctly. Deadening your door panels would also be a wise decision. If you are not terribly concerned about sound stage at this point, rear speakers are perfectly fine as well.

Bettr n' Revrse
01-18-2012, 02:02 AM
Ya thats all just bad lol... It sounds like you arent happy cuz of the install Id bet...

dmoney68m8
01-18-2012, 03:13 AM
what exactly is it that you do not like about your system?

i cant get anything to sound right on it i mean it's probably because i have everything stock except the subs and also am in desperate need of some dynamat cause when i really crank it it can get hard to breath, but it's just kind of agravating so i keep trying to think of ways to fix it, and trying to save up the money to do it while i'm bored out of my mind drawing up all these crazy schematics and plans for my system.
thanks for the input though

dmoney68m8
01-18-2012, 03:14 AM
and oh as to why so many speakers i just really want to make a lot of noise but i don't want it to sound like sh*t when i'm making it

Mitch86
01-18-2012, 03:22 AM
As said before you'd most likely be better off with a nice set up front set up properly vs speakers everywhere. Get a nice comp set, deaden everything and possibly EQ it to your likings. If this doesn't do what you want you can add speakers from there.

dmoney68m8
01-18-2012, 03:55 AM
that's probably what i'll end up doing i just want everything to be perfect and i keep coming up with all these crazy ideas that sound great when i think of them but really they're not all that great

Mitch86
01-18-2012, 04:21 AM
that's probably what i'll end up doing i just want everything to be perfect and i keep coming up with all these crazy ideas that sound great when i think of them but really they're not all that great
Lol. You never know, you may prefer your ideas to what we are suggesting. But it will be much easier and cost effective to keep it simple and go from there. Wouldn't it be great to just have 1 nice set of speakers and get the sound you want. On the other hand it wouldn't be so great to install 6-8 speakers and still not like what youre hearing.

dmoney68m8
01-18-2012, 05:42 AM
true

dumple
01-18-2012, 06:30 AM
I don't get why people say a rear stage is pointless my rear stage blends so well that if your eyes are closed and just the mids/highs are playing it would be hard to pick out, its all in the processing and time alignment of the speakers in my opinion

VWBobby
01-18-2012, 07:35 AM
Hehe, I like how this is in the "Advanced" SQL/SPL discussion instead of the General Discussion or Speakers sections.... :)

An amplified front stage should be your top priority. Having 100W++ going to a set of good quality components is going to be night and day different. Then you can upgrade your rear speakers later on down the road.

Rear fill is a personal preference. Some people hate it, try to act like rear fill is going to cancel out your whole front stage, etc. Its not like rear fill is a 5000lb gorilla in the back seat. ;) I like a little rear fill with most of the sound faded to the front and most of the high end cut off.

whitedragon551
01-18-2012, 07:40 AM
I don't get why people say a rear stage is pointless my rear stage blends so well that if your eyes are closed and just the mids/highs are playing it would be hard to pick out, its all in the processing and time alignment of the speakers in my opinion

Not a clue. I would assume because added rear fill makes getting the front stage right that much harder. Especially without the proper tools.

dumple
01-18-2012, 08:40 AM
Not a clue. I would assume because added rear fill makes getting the front stage right that much harder. Especially without the proper tools.

Are you agreeing with me because I feel like you have a pretty good understanding of what the aoundstage is, then again.sound stage is up to the person listening, some people like it front of them l, me personally I like my aoundstage ear level in the center of the vehicle. Again the processing is key

Why So Cereal?
01-18-2012, 09:02 AM
I don't get why people say a rear stage is pointless my rear stage blends so well that if your eyes are closed and just the mids/highs are playing it would be hard to pick out, its all in the processing and time alignment of the speakers in my opinion

I agree. I really like rear fill, I just didn't have enough channels to attenuate it until now. All u really have to do is low pass it and fade it out till its barely there. Even without T/A u can make it sound decent. My stage is still centered and now i have better ambiance and stage depth. I know T/a would perfect it though.

dumple
01-18-2012, 10:54 AM
I agree. I really like rear fill, I just didn't have enough channels to attenuate it until now. All u really have to do is low pass it and fade it out till its barely there. Even without T/A u can make it sound decent. My stage is still centered and now i have better ambiance and stage depth. I know T/a would perfect it though.

I liked the crisp clean sound you had in the videos you made, I'm sure its better in person but agreed some ta could only improve the sound, I think alot.of.your system has to do with them tweeters

Why So Cereal?
01-18-2012, 11:39 AM
I liked the crisp clean sound you had in the videos you made, I'm sure its better in person but agreed some ta could only improve the sound, I think alot.of.your system has to do with them tweeters

Thanks man. I'm really not huge fan of my current tweets. They sound nice for the price though. I really want to do pillars with my tangbands and my LPG tweets to get rid of this beaming effect I have now. But idk if I want to do that major a mod yet. I also got an offer to be sponsored by this local shop but in that case I have to choose one brand and stick with it throughout the system....just weighing options. But for now, it sounds very good. I love it.

keep_hope_alive
01-18-2012, 07:23 PM
the OP isn't talking about rear fill. he's wanting more sound to come from behind than in front.

we used to do this a lot back in the 80's and 90's. we were happy.

having full range rear speakers can sound good to most people. rear full range 6x9's are still hugely popular.

having stock speakers is why your system is not making you happy.

the OP needs to replace his front speakers with a good component set, seal his doors, and put a good amp on them before he does anything else. that is always step #1. you can get plenty loud with a nice set of front speakers. adding more speakers usually make the sound worse because you get to many arrival times which results in cancellation and phase interference.

but only after you get the front speakers set up well, do you add rear speakers to see how they affect the overall sound.

adding rear deck speakers will suffer distortion from being pressurized by the subs.

icehellion
02-10-2012, 02:51 PM
what exactly is it that you do not like about your system?

i cant get anything to sound right on it i mean it's probably because i have everything stock except the subs and also am in desperate need of some dynamat cause when i really crank it it can get hard to breath, but it's just kind of agravating so i keep trying to think of ways to fix it, and trying to save up the money to do it while i'm bored out of my mind drawing up all these crazy schematics and plans for my system.
thanks for the input though

Everything is stock except your Subs and Amp? Thats your problem.
Anything can be loud it just won't sound good.

Whats your Budget?

Amperage rating of your Alternator? Normal Non-Audio Amperage Load?
Battery Size?
Sub/Sub Amp Brand? How are they Wired? Whats there Amp Load on your Car?

First you need to know your cars electrical system capacity and then work with that and your budget. If you put amps and speakers that are too powerful your car will never sound good unless you upgrade your electrical system which is big $$$.

When you work that out, we can look at speakers, amps and different installation techniques.

dmoney68m8
02-15-2012, 09:01 PM
Everything is stock except your Subs and Amp? Thats your problem.
Anything can be loud it just won't sound good.

Whats your Budget?

Amperage rating of your Alternator? Normal Non-Audio Amperage Load?
Battery Size?
Sub/Sub Amp Brand? How are they Wired? Whats there Amp Load on your Car?

First you need to know your cars electrical system capacity and then work with that and your budget. If you put amps and speakers that are too powerful your car will never sound good unless you upgrade your electrical system which is big $$$.

When you work that out, we can look at speakers, amps and different installation techniques.

umm i've made a lot of changes since this post but i'm still having a lot of problems
as for my battery and altenator it's all stock i can try to find out some specifics and get back to you but idk it;s an 02 cavalier if that helps
as for budget i'm a kid in highschool with no job that's broke so not a lot lol if that helps any
here's what i'm running right now i have a kenwood head unit with one set of 2v rca outputs i've got a cheap set of monster rca's running to a jl audio 500 watt amp with a 4 guage monster amp wiring kit for the amp as well the amp is powering 2 jl audio wov3's rated for 300rms each in a ported enclosure. i have 2 clarion 6x8 2 way coaxial's i believe are rated for 35rms eac along with 2 motorolla piezo tweeters in my front(not sure on the ratings for them) they're only being powered off my kenwood head unit so i guess they're splitting 22rms each which is 11 rms per front speaker. in the back i have 2 infinity kappa 6x9 2 way coaxials i believe are rated for 110rms each they were being powered by the head unit but i attempted to add a 4 way jensen amp and since then i've had nothing but headaches. i had some extra 4 guage wire left over from my power wire so i tapped into my power wire and ground now both the power wire and ground split off with one end going to each amp i did the same for the remote turn on. i'm not positive but either i screwed up some where or only the 2 front channels work on my jensen i'm not sure on the specifics but i know each channel is capable of puting out 90rms at 2 ohms and i have the 2 front channels powering the 2 infinity kappa's in the rear now i wouldn't be too unhappy with the set up like this infact it doesn't sound half bad even with the infinity's running off the kenwood's 22rms per channel but since i've hooked up the second amp first off when i turn my car on i hear an alien like sound coming out of my infinity's(only way i could think of describing it)music still plays but the sound will not stop also after i turn the volume passed a certain point the subs and 6x9's start sounding flat they still move and with the 6x9's now too almost blows my trunk off but they don't produce anything that sounds like real sound if that makes any sense at all. also when the volume gets past that point my lights start going bezerk to the beat of the music. oh i think i forgot to mention i used a really cheap pair of rca's from walmart to go from the jl amp's rca output to the front channel rca input on the jensen(have another pair of rca's as well same brand but i figure no use using them on channels that don't work)
sorry for so much but i think i got just about everything i know about and have done for my system right now, any suggestions or if i've done anything wrong from what info i've provided please let me know it would be very much appreciated

keep_hope_alive
02-16-2012, 01:19 AM
Could be a bad amp. Some Jensen amps have been troublesome for me over the years, most were prone to noise.

Don't worry about a loud system until you can afford a loud system. :)