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View Full Version : Midbass from 5 1/4" components?



tetelestia
02-03-2011, 04:05 PM
I searched but never found much.

My car stock has 5 1/4" speakers up front and I'm pulling everything together to redo the sound system on it. It would be a lot of work and involve modifying the door pockets to fit 6 or 6 1/2" speakers, but I'm just wondering how much midbass you can get from 5 1/4" speakers? The speakers I'm most likely getting are the Phoenix Gold RSD components, in whichever size works best. A small sealed enclosure will be made for them either way.

I'll have a 10" sub in the back, likely crossed over fairly high, but I don't want a huge gap between the sub and speakers

I'll be putting about 100W RMS to the two front speakers, 200W RMS to the sub

So, is it worth the effort to make new speaker surrounds in the door pockets for 6 or 6 1/2" or can you get decent midbass from 5 1/2" speakers?

RAM_Designs
02-03-2011, 04:07 PM
Don't expect a whole lot. You be much better off modding your door to fit 6.5's.

trumpet
02-03-2011, 04:43 PM
Instead of making a small enclosure for each woofer instead focus on treating the doors to act like a large partially sealed enclosure. Those big holes in the sheet metal behind the door panel can be covered with a removable panel, of which there are several methods to make them. I wouldn't give up hope on 5-1/4" components yet.

ramos
02-03-2011, 04:45 PM
Instead of making a small enclosure for each woofer instead focus on treating the doors to act like a large partially sealed enclosure. Those big holes in the sheet metal behind the door panel can be covered with a removable panel, of which there are several methods to make them. I wouldn't give up hope on 5-1/4" components yet.


What this guy said. Small sealed enclosures would more than likely hurt midbass performance. 5 1/4's can be some bad mfers installed correctly :)

RAM_Designs
02-03-2011, 04:48 PM
What this guy said. Small sealed enclosures would more than likely hurt midbass performance. 5 1/4's can be some bad mfers installed correctly :)

But I think we can both agree that 6.5's have more midbass potential, especially considering the options available on the market for 5.25" and 6.5" mids :D

ramos
02-03-2011, 04:53 PM
Of course, a larger speaker better be able to play lower, with less effort and more output. But you got to look at cost vs. reward. not knowing what vehicle makes this a little difficult. Is it worth the ouput gained in the midbass regions to do the work to make 6.5's fit. Some vehicles it's a no brainer and do it too it. I can think of a few ( most audi) that it would require an arse ton of work for minimal gains. I'm a do it right, and only once kind of person. My doors had 5 1/4's and thought I needed more midbass

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/moyerme/0430101215.jpg


lol :)

RAM_Designs
02-03-2011, 04:58 PM
Nice SLS. :D

I like the dude at diyma who had the pair of sls 6.5's on each side. Tons of effortless bass-midbass right there...it'd be taxing on the rattles though.

ramos
02-03-2011, 05:06 PM
Nice SLS. :D

I like the dude at diyma who had the pair of sls 6.5's on each side. Tons of effortless bass-midbass right there...it'd be taxing on the rattles though.

Drake I think has the dual 6.5's

The extra rattle and vibration control needed to handle the larger speaker is all part of the cost vs reward. A simple test for the op would be to seal the holes in the door as well as possible and listen to the factory speakers for a little while and see if the midbass improves any. Imrovement would lead me to believe he is losing a lot of energy to the door instead of being output. :)

RAM_Designs
02-03-2011, 05:08 PM
Drake I think has the dual 6.5's
I don't remember who it was exactly, I just remember solid steel enclosures in the doors.


The extra rattle and vibration control needed to handle the larger speaker is all part of the cost vs reward. A simple test for the op would be to seal the holes in the door as well as possible and listen to the factory speakers for a little while and see if the midbass improves any. Imrovement would lead me to believe he is losing a lot of energy to the door instead of being output. :)

True.

tetelestia
02-03-2011, 05:35 PM
I actually have no stereo at all right now in the car, currently putting it all back together, so I can't check the factory speakers. I don't even have any door pockets here right now to measure off of, so once those show up, I'll measure it, see how much work it'll take and how much work I feel like putting into it!

And I suppose I won't be making a sealed enclosure for them! I'll just have to find some way of making sure the door pocket is held onto the door card well

*edit - second question, if I were to mount the speaker to the the door, how would it sound pushing through the factory grill for a 5 1/4" speaker? Something like the setup in the link below. I'd love to buy his door pockets, but $400 is just a bit pricey for me!
forums_vwvortex_com/showthread_php?4824989-FS-Custom-Door-Pockets-w-Speaker-Mounts (change the 3 underscores to periods as this forum won't let me post links...)

zako
02-09-2011, 04:28 AM
First of all, if you want to have good bass response from your door speakers, I suggest to invest some money into deadening the doors. One door kit of Dynamat Xtreme and one door kit of Dynamat Dynaliner foam will suffice. Use one layer of Xtreme to completely cover the middle panel in the door and seal all the holes in it. Apply a layer of Dynaliner on top of it. As you go also save any sizable Xtreme scraps and attach them to your door's exterior skin. Covering only 25% of surface is enough. Apply them to the center of the flat metal surface. If you can afford it, also buy a Dynaxorb kit and place the rubber pads right behind the speakers. They will scatter the back-waves. I have done this in my doors, and this improved bass a lot, and also eliminated rattles.

Regarding speakers, I have Alpine Type R 6-1/2 in those doors and they play strongly down to like 60Hz. They play down to like 30Hz pretty impressively but a proper sub is certainly louder in low frequencies. I have them crossed at 60Hz. I guess if you get the 5-1/4, you should be able to play down to at least 70-80Hz, and let the sub handle the rest of low frequencies. And it seems like your amp has enough power to drive them (they're rated 100watt RMS, at 4ohms I think)

Bob Saget
02-09-2011, 04:36 AM
First of all, if you want to have good bass response from your door speakers, I suggest to invest some money into deadening the doors. One door kit of Dynamat Xtreme and one door kit of Dynamat Dynaliner foam will suffice. Use one layer of Xtreme to completely cover the middle panel in the door and seal all the holes in it. Apply a layer of Dynaliner on top of it. As you go also save any sizable Xtreme scraps and attach them to your door's exterior skin. Covering only 25% of surface is enough. Apply them to the center of the flat metal surface. If you can afford it, also buy a Dynaxorb kit and place the rubber pads right behind the speakers. They will scatter the back-waves. I have done this in my doors, and this improved bass a lot, and also eliminated rattles.

Regarding speakers, I have Alpine Type R 6-1/2 in those doors and they play strongly down to like 60Hz. They play down to like 30Hz pretty impressively but a proper sub is certainly louder in low frequencies. I have them crossed at 60Hz. I guess if you get the 5-1/4, you should be able to play down to at least 70-80Hz, and let the sub handle the rest of low frequencies. And it seems like your amp has enough power to drive them (they're rated 100watt RMS, at 4ohms I think)

Dynamat is a waste of money. Much better deadener can be had, & for less money.

Imtjnotu
02-09-2011, 06:09 AM
I wish I could get some custom speaker pods put in my 535...my bmw up front only holds 5"

subzero
02-09-2011, 08:00 AM
I actually have no stereo at all right now in the car, currently putting it all back together, so I can't check the factory speakers. I don't even have any door pockets here right now to measure off of, so once those show up, I'll measure it, see how much work it'll take and how much work I feel like putting into it!

And I suppose I won't be making a sealed enclosure for them! I'll just have to find some way of making sure the door pocket is held onto the door card well

*edit - second question, if I were to mount the speaker to the the door, how would it sound pushing through the factory grill for a 5 1/4" speaker? Something like the setup in the link below. I'd love to buy his door pockets, but $400 is just a bit pricey for me!
forums_vwvortex_com/showthread_php?4824989-FS-Custom-Door-Pockets-w-Speaker-Mounts (change the 3 underscores to periods as this forum won't let me post links...)

you can make your own baffels for a fraction of what that guy paid. and sealing the door will also help. Get some deadener and sludge and some closed cell foam.

c_nitty
02-09-2011, 12:24 PM
I have a set of 5.25 comps for sale on here.You can feel the basss from them and are very close to to 6.5 with much better sq.

Louisiana_CRX
02-09-2011, 12:27 PM
there is a guy on the forum selling a nice set of Blaupunkt Velocity 5 1/4componets...those are very nice ...

c_nitty
02-09-2011, 12:58 PM
there is a guy on the forum selling a nice set of Blaupunkt Velocity 5 1/4componets...those are very nice ...
Thanks man I guess people just do not know how good they sound.

zako
02-09-2011, 03:24 PM
Dynamat is a waste of money. Much better deadener can be had, & for less money.

Your elitist and uninformative comment comment is a waste of everyone's bandwidth. Seriously. Care to explain what gives you the authority to say such tihngs?

The door kit of Dynamat Xtreme is sold for only $50 with free shipping and works great. Easy to apply. Best $50 ever spent. Hardly I could call this a waste of money. I have cross-shopped and roughly know what's out there. If you need only 12.5sq ft of bytil based vibration deadener, this is the best value or at least no worse than others. It has about as good thickness and weight as Raammat BXTII, Hushmat, and the regular SS Damplifier, just read the specs. SS Damplifier Pro is slightly thicker, slightly more expensive. If you need $37ft^3 of material, Raammat is a good value, being sold for just over $100 (with shipping). I have a box of raammat in storage. It basically the same stuff. All in all raammat is the best value per square ft. However, I could hardly call Dynamat Xtreme Door kit a waste of money based on that.. and you can't buy raammat on amazon.com. And guess what, my $50 Dynamat Xtreme Door kit cost me $0 because I have used an amazon.com gift certificate.

ramos
02-09-2011, 05:30 PM
Your elitist and uninformative comment comment is a waste of everyone's bandwidth. Seriously. Care to explain what gives you the authority to say such tihngs?

The door kit of Dynamat Xtreme is sold for only $50 with free shipping and works great. Easy to apply. Best $50 ever spent. Hardly I could call this a waste of money. I have cross-shopped and roughly know what's out there. If you need only 12.5sq ft of bytil based vibration deadener, this is the best value or at least no worse than others. It has about as good thickness and weight as Raammat BXTII, Hushmat, and the regular SS Damplifier, just read the specs. SS Damplifier Pro is slightly thicker, slightly more expensive. If you need $37ft^3 of material, Raammat is a good value, being sold for just over $100 (with shipping). I have a box of raammat in storage. It basically the same stuff. All in all raammat is the best value per square ft. However, I could hardly call Dynamat Xtreme Door kit a waste of money based on that.. and you can't buy raammat on amazon.com. And guess what, my $50 Dynamat Xtreme Door kit cost me $0 because I have used an amazon.com gift certificate.

WUT? lol I believe all he was saying is that dynamat is more expensive than other comparable products, which is true no matter if it's sold on amazon or not :fyi: :)

RAM_Designs
02-09-2011, 05:53 PM
WUT? lol I believe all he was saying is that dynamat is more expensive than other comparable products, which is true no matter if it's sold on amazon or not :fyi: :)

He actually said that much better deadener can be had, which assumes that Dynamat is an inferior product. Had he said, "you can get the same quality stuff for less" then I'd agree with you. Not saying that Dynamat is the best, as I believe there are a few brands that are pretty much equal, but it definitely does not have a competing company that is "much better", IMO.