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View Full Version : Now Offering Services For Transmision Line Enclosure Design



ciaonzo
06-02-2010, 12:44 PM
Considering the demographic, I'm fairly impressed with the number of gentlemen on this site who are interested in venturing into the Sound Quality end of the spectrum recently, so to perpetuate that spirit, I would like to begin offering my design services pertaining to transmission lines. I've done about a dozen or so for various members and the feedback has been wonderful. I'm only one man and I do the math long-hand, in the evenings, so depending on my workload it may take a little time to get back to you with the final design. Maybe one day, maybe two or three days. If I become too busy to provide a reasonable turn around time, I'll let you know before I accept your submission. Don't really see that happening, though. Nominal fee is $30 with sketches and a cut list. I don't provide a cut sheet that shows you how to get the most out of your sheet of MDF.

To be clear, when I say design, I do not mean a fancy drawing that you can start a thread with to receive attention from your friends. By design, I mean arriving at a target performance (frequency response, etc...) for a given driver based on applied mathematics. I utilize the design principals of Augspurger, Bailey, and a tiny bit of D'Appolito. Yes, you will get a drawing. It will be a simple, but very neat, pencil sketch to aid in identifying each piece for the purposes of assembly (sent by file, either a Photobucket link or an email attachment).

You should be aware that transmission lines are not very efficient and are not generally associated with high output. If you're looking for high output, build a vented enclosure. At best, the efficiency will match that of a sealed enclosure for the same driver (although, there is a gain in output for the lowest octave compared with the sealed enclosure, but it remains relative to the overall efficiency). As a norm, a properly designed TL will actually have a lower efficiency than sealed, especially with a shorter, tapered line. That's not to say that you won't be loud with a TL, but it basically becomes a function of the driver's abilities. TL's are also usually quite large and impractical for most, and some can be quite challenging to build, so this isn't for everyone.

So why build a TL? Well, as I said earlier, for the purposes of SQ! Musicality on a completely different level. The only thing I've heard that sounds better than a TL for bass duty is no enclosure at all (dipole and IB). You will enjoy a relatively benign impedance/phase profile (which means your driver will appear as a less reactive load, ensuring your amplifier will maintain it's composure and have very little difficulty delivering power and keeping control), a very wide bandwidth, and a superb group delay/transient response. You will enjoy impact and great upper end response, facilitating a potentially seamless transition into the midbass being produced by your front stage. You will also enjoy effortless subterranean low frequencies, which is what subwoofers are supposed to be all about in the first place. But most importantly, you will retain musicality. You will enjoy the rich harmonic complexities that you've been missing with your high tuned, transient degrading, boom boxes. All within the limits of your driver selection and your vehicle's transfer function, of course.

TL's are fairly forgiving when it comes to driver selection but there are limitations. I can manipulate the enclosure to a small degree (potentially limited by your available space) to allow for a wide variety of driver parameters (or your musical tastes for that matter) but please avoid drivers with a very high or very low Qts number. Shoot for the combination of a low Fs and a high Xmax. Good thermal and mechanical power handling is important but it's not necessary to use these beast multi-kilowatt, triple spider, nut-busters. In fact, that would be counter-intuitive. Remember - it's all about retaining the musicality. I'd also be glad to assist you with driver selection once you're booked for a design.



Things I'll need from you in the form of a PM;

* Your desired form of contact (PM or email) and some PayPal love.

* Driver specs - as much detail as you can provide.

* Maximum physical dimensions allowed and any preferences you may have for appearance (proportions, driver/terminus orientation, etc...).

* Acoustic environment (trunk, hatch, wagon, etc...).

* Some basic info regarding your listening habits, goals, equipment, etc...

* Any other concerns you may have.



Shoot me a PM when you're ready. :)

Go2Sleep
06-02-2010, 01:48 PM
Thanks,
Ciaonzo definitely knows his stuff.

ciaonzo
06-02-2010, 06:38 PM
Thanks for the vote of confidence!

ciaonzo
06-03-2010, 06:10 PM
I've edited the above to include sketches for every submission as well as a single price, rather than offering two levels of service. Thanks!

ciaonzo
06-05-2010, 01:14 PM
Up.

ciaonzo
06-06-2010, 07:34 PM
Only two people so far, lol.

Don't be skeered. :up2somet:

RAM_Designs
06-07-2010, 12:55 AM
sounds like a bunch on essque hogwash to me :D

ShiningBuick
06-07-2010, 01:27 AM
Very interesting.. I have no desire for an enclosure like this, however I am verrry interested in where you learned your stuff!!

Did you take classes and so forth in sound and enclosure dynamics, or is it the culmination of years of independent book research? I'd be interested in knowing more about this.

ciaonzo
06-07-2010, 09:27 AM
sounds like a bunch on essque hogwash to me :Dlol


Very interesting.. I have no desire for an enclosure like this, however I am verrry interested in where you learned your stuff!!

Did you take classes and so forth in sound and enclosure dynamics, or is it the culmination of years of independent book research? I'd be interested in knowing more about this.No formal classes or anything, just LOTS of reading and experience over the years. I built my first "normal" enclosure when I was 12, and my first TL back in '94. It was mostly guess work based on my new understanding of the 1/4 wave theory but there was very limited information at that time. What was available, was widely varied since there was no real consensus for what was correct. Anyway, it was successful. I built a line for a 4" Vifa driver and it blew me away. I've barely built anything else besides TL's since that time.

These days there's a wealth of information out there so it shouldn't take you long to inform yourself on the topic. Happy hunting!

grimreper912003
06-07-2010, 09:49 AM
Definatly a guy to trust here! I would put him in charge of me system if he did SPL. :)

ciaonzo
06-07-2010, 04:13 PM
Definatly a guy to trust here! I would put him in charge of me system if he did SPL. :)Thanks! I can do the SPL thing, I just don't enjoy it. :crap:

Jroo
06-08-2010, 06:37 PM
im very interested in a Tline. I bought some cheap clearance woofers that I was told would work well in a Tline. Is there any way with the specs you could tell me how big the box would be before buying plans. If the box ends up taking all of my hatch, I dont want to do it. I was told a quarter wave would give me some space back. Any truth to that

bhsdriller
06-08-2010, 06:57 PM
are these boxes a lot bigger than normal ported or no?

I'm interested just don't have a lot of room

ciaonzo
06-08-2010, 07:51 PM
im very interested in a Tline. I bought some cheap clearance woofers that I was told would work well in a Tline. Is there any way with the specs you could tell me how big the box would be before buying plans. If the box ends up taking all of my hatch, I dont want to do it. I was told a quarter wave would give me some space back. Any truth to that


are these boxes a lot bigger than normal ported or no?

I'm interested just don't have a lot of roomYeah fellas, these enclosures are relatively large. Easily as large their vented counterpart, or larger, in some cases. I would never reccommend a TL for a space-saving solution, lol. There are ways to get clever but we're still somewhat limited by the minimum requirements for line length and cross section, depending on the overall goal. You can only make them so small before you begin to compromise performance in some way or another.

If either of you would like to send me a PM with the drivers in question and the maximum dimensions for your available space, I could let you know if it's feasible.

ciaonzo
06-10-2010, 03:54 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghK4GVpZaVc

Savstyle
06-10-2010, 04:04 PM
Yeah fellas, these enclosures are relatively large. Easily as large their vented counterpart, or larger, in some cases. I would never reccommend a TL for a space-saving solution, lol. There are ways to get clever but we're still somewhat limited by the minimum requirements for line length and cross section, depending on the overall goal. You can only make them so small before you begin to compromise performance in some way or another.

If either of you would like to send me a PM with the drivers in question and the maximum dimensions for your available space, I could let you know if it's feasible.

Hahaha

agreed

Tl's are bigums

Great frickin boxs tho. If i had room in my hatch to do a tl for my idq15 u would allready have my money.

Wish ya luck man:D

ciaonzo
06-10-2010, 04:07 PM
Thanks a bunch, Niggz.

Jroo
06-11-2010, 03:43 PM
sent you a pm with specs to see if it something you can work with.

ciaonzo
06-13-2010, 11:59 PM
Who's next?

ciaonzo
06-16-2010, 04:56 AM
Upperzzzz.

ciaonzo
06-19-2010, 10:16 PM
Everyone who submitted a request on Friday and Saturday will have their design on Monday. Thanks!

ciaonzo
06-20-2010, 06:54 PM
Everyone who submitted a request on Friday and Saturday will have their design on Monday. Thanks!Scratch that, all were delivered today. :)

subzero
06-23-2010, 11:39 AM
I ventured into the sq aspect of CA, I cant say I'm 100% satisfied, but thats cuz I still like it LOUD. Look up my build log if you need a point of refference for judging how big the box may be. Mine is a folded tline, and I do have polyfil inside the box behind the sub. My system sounds incredibly clean and accurate , with the help of my new componet set and hours of tuning the freq's. At this point, the only thing I wish, is that I could add another sub, but then that would undermind the whole purpose, which was to eliminate box volume and improve SQ. So, I am looking into purchasing a different sub, hoping to gain more output and better SQ.

JimJ
06-23-2010, 12:14 PM
I didn't see Martin King referenced in there...any reason not to use his models?

DBfan187
06-23-2010, 12:28 PM
OP was threatened by James Earl Ray's family

ciaonzo
06-23-2010, 09:34 PM
I didn't see Martin King referenced in there...any reason not to use his models?
The main reason is because when I began to take an interest in learning about TL's back in the early 90's, his work was not readily available. Or, if it was, I was totally unaware of it.

Bailey and Augspurger were the true pioneers as I see it. King simply built upon their established works to provide his extensive modeling worksheets and develop his own hybrids. And with his own extensive math skills, King brought about a consistency that wasn't there before but he really didn't offer anything more than I needed. He's got a lot of useful tools on his site, don't get me wrong. But I'd already been building them long enough on my own to compile sufficient trial and error data, using numerous driver types and different environments so that things weren't a mystery to me anymore by the time he became known to me.

Aside from all that, he's most known for his hybrid types which I feel are not true TL's and only came about to give an incentive to buy his licensing rights. That's just my opinion, though it shouldn't be taken very seriously as we're not in competition. I built one of his hybrids and while it did offer a bit more output compared to traditional TL's, it also offered a bit more resonant character. It's a mix between a heavily tapered TL and a relatively large vented enclosure and that's what it sounds like. To me, that defeats the true purpose of a TL. It's a matter of preference, I guess.



OP was threatened by James Earl Ray's family
Iseewutyoudidthurrlulz.

ciaonzo
06-25-2010, 08:11 PM
YouTube - Beck - Readymade (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiJmU1nKbpY)

ciaonzo
06-28-2010, 07:32 PM
YouTube - Master Tang - Animal song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8pISIZfWpI&feature=related)

ciaonzo
07-01-2010, 09:07 PM
All quiet now, no more SQ guys left? lol

ciaonzo
07-08-2010, 11:43 AM
Bump!

ciaonzo
07-11-2010, 06:36 PM
Come to the dark side.

subzero
07-12-2010, 10:56 AM
what 2000watt rms 12 would you put in there that would be louder than my t5-12 rated 900rms 1100peak...

ciaonzo
07-12-2010, 11:18 AM
what 2000watt rms 12 would you put in there that would be louder than my t5-12 rated 900rms 1100peak...You're talking to a Sound Quality guy, power ratings mean almost nothing to me because I don't spend my time trying to get loud. I'm all about bandwidth and low distortion. :)

subzero
07-12-2010, 11:33 AM
Well, I want SQ, but I need it loud cuz ima hearing inpaired. Guess I bee keep looking.

KenExc2007
07-12-2010, 04:20 PM
So i dnt really kno anything about this TL box but it sounds interesting. Im gonna send you a pm about givin u tha driver specs. is the planet audio bb15d a good choice for this box? Im not too worried about it sounding loud (but i would like a little spl but more sq than anything). im gonna have the Kenwood Excelon X1200M powering it. i will send u a pm about tha rest

ciaonzo
07-13-2010, 09:43 PM
So i dnt really kno anything about this TL box but it sounds interesting. Im gonna send you a pm about givin u tha driver specs. is the planet audio bb15d a good choice for this box? Im not too worried about it sounding loud (but i would like a little spl but more sq than anything). im gonna have the Kenwood Excelon X1200M powering it. i will send u a pm about tha restThanks, got it. Sent you an email.

ciaonzo
07-22-2010, 06:12 PM
Who's next? PM me!

marcotheclepto
07-22-2010, 08:22 PM
im tempted but all the only small sub i got is worth less than the 30$ design :)