PDA

View Full Version : coax vs component



thisandthat
02-10-2010, 05:52 PM
All things being equal, cross over, tweeter, and woofer, is there any advantage to getting a component over a coax other then the flexibility of woofer/tweeter placement.

Reason I ask is that I need a pair of speakers for my dash, its at about a 30 degree angle (from facing up), so I figure if I got a pair of coax with adjustable tweeters and a good cross over it would be the same as getting a pair of components.

What do you think?

misfit138
02-10-2010, 06:36 PM
I think components > coaxials. :fyi:

However, several companies offer nice components that give you the option of mounting the tweeter on axis. Boston Acoustics, CDT and Image Dynamics come to mind immediately...

Examples:

http://www.woofersetc.com/p5712/XS65--Image-Dynamics-65"-2-Way-Component-System.htm

http://www.woofersetc.com/p1078/Pro60--Boston-Acoustics-Pro-65"-2Way-Component-Speakers.htm

http://www.woofersetc.com/p5541/SPZ60--Boston-Acoustic-65"-2-Way-Reference-Component-system.htm

http://www.woofersetc.com/p4361/HD63-GOLD--CDT-Audio-65"-2-Way-Gold-Series-Component-System.htm

Turbo24
02-10-2010, 07:30 PM
I think components > coaxials. :fyi:

However, several companies offer nice components that give you the option of mounting the tweeter on axis. Boston Acoustics, CDT and Image Dynamics come to mind immediately...

Examples:

XS-65 - Image Dynamics 6.5" 2 Way Component System (http://www.woofersetc.com/p5712/XS65--Image-Dynamics-65"-2-Way-Component-System.htm)

Pro60 - Boston Acoustics Pro 6.5" 2-Way Component Speakers (http://www.woofersetc.com/p1078/Pro60--Boston-Acoustics-Pro-65"-2Way-Component-Speakers.htm)

SPZ60 - Boston Acoustic 6.5" 2 Way Reference Component system (http://www.woofersetc.com/p5541/SPZ60--Boston-Acoustic-65"-2-Way-Reference-Component-system.htm)

HD-63 GOLD - CDT Audio 6.5" 2 Way Gold Series Component System (http://www.woofersetc.com/p4361/HD63-GOLD--CDT-Audio-65"-2-Way-Gold-Series-Component-System.htm)


what about somethin like this?? obviously they cant compare to BA or CDT but its the same principal right??

Rockford Fosgate Power T1652 (09-t1652) 6-1/2" Speakers Car Speakers Car Audio Car Audio, Video, & GPS Navigation - Sonic Electronix (http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_19511_Rockford+Fosgate+Power+T1652.html)

thisandthat
02-11-2010, 02:50 AM
I know theres quite a few out there that let you use them as both, which is nice to have the flexibility. Why do you think components are better the coaxial, is there anything solid reason they are better (other then placement flexibility).

Home speakers don't use coaxial, there must be a reason for this, are the cheaper to make, or is there a reason they keep them apart (aka they sound better), and if they do sound better why?


I think components > coaxials. :fyi:

However, several companies offer nice components that give you the option of mounting the tweeter on axis. Boston Acoustics, CDT and Image Dynamics come to mind immediately...

Rickna
02-11-2010, 09:48 AM
For accutate reproduction and true stereo imaging components are the only way to go.

misfit138
02-11-2010, 11:57 AM
what about somethin like this?? obviously they cant compare to BA or CDT but its the same principal right??

Rockford Fosgate Power T1652 (09-t1652) 6-1/2" Speakers Car Speakers Car Audio Car Audio, Video, & GPS Navigation - Sonic Electronix (http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_19511_Rockford+Fosgate+Power+T1652.html)

I use the older model RF Power components and like them pretty well.

The ones you linked have no external crossover...

misfit138
02-11-2010, 12:05 PM
I know theres quite a few out there that let you use them as both, which is nice to have the flexibility. Why do you think components are better the coaxial, is there anything solid reason they are better (other then placement flexibility).

Component speakers are often made with better materials, handle more power, have superior crossovers and produce better midbass than coaxials. There are lots of other reasons too. If you're that intrigued, I'm sure you can do some reading on google.


Home speakers don't use coaxial, there must be a reason for this, are the cheaper to make, or is there a reason they keep them apart (aka they sound better), and if they do sound better why?

False.

http://i327.photobucket.com/albums/k460/savage1119/thiel.jpg

JimJ
02-11-2010, 12:15 PM
Home speakers don't use coaxial, there must be a reason for this, are the cheaper to make, or is there a reason they keep them apart (aka they sound better), and if they do sound better why?

In a perfect world (i.e, at home), coaxially mounting the tweeter has several advantages :) Tannoy, KEF, PHY, and many others do this.

It isn't recommended in a vehicle because of the problems of getting the speakers on-axis; the ability to mount the tweeter elsewhere helps with mounting compromises. But if path lengths were equalized, bi-amped coaxials could sound very good :)

misfit138
02-11-2010, 12:18 PM
In a perfect world (i.e, at home), coaxially mounting the tweeter has several advantages :) Tannoy, KEF, PHY, and many others do this.

It isn't recommended in a vehicle because of the problems of getting the speakers on-axis; the ability to mount the tweeter elsewhere helps with mounting compromises. But if path lengths were equalized, bi-amped coaxials could sound very good :)

Just curious. Do you have any experience with Thiel? If so, what do you think of their products?

thisandthat
02-11-2010, 04:15 PM
I guess you missed the first part of the forum, I'm saying if all things being equal, materials crossovers etc. For example there are speakers that give you the option of coax and component placement of the tweeters. These are exactly the same speakers, so what is the reason you would place the tweeters away from the woofers. I realize if your speakers go in the door or some weird place its good to have the tweeters facing you, but lets assume thats not a problem.


Component speakers are often made with better materials, handle more power, have superior crossovers and produce better midbass than coaxials. There are lots of other reasons too. If you're that intrigued, I'm sure you can do some reading on google.




Home speakers don't use coaxial, there must be a reason for this, are the cheaper to make, or is there a reason they keep them apart (aka they sound better), and if they do sound better why?




False.


What do you mean false...false what? This wasn't a statement its a question.

JimJ
02-11-2010, 06:04 PM
What do you mean false...false what? This wasn't a statement its a question.

He meant the "home speakers don't use coaxials" part :) His point was that some do. Heck, my current speakers don't even have tweeters or a crossover of any kind, but that's a separate issue :p:


I'm saying if all things being equal, materials crossovers etc. For example there are speakers that give you the option of coax and component placement of the tweeters.

I thought I answered this? It's because of the compromises in speaker mounting in a vehicle...to get a coherent stereo image, it often takes things that are backwards logically that you'd never do at home, like putting tweeters on a different axis than the midbasses. With coaxes, you're locked into on-axis mounting both at the same time, which may or may not be practical.


Just curious. Do you have any experience with Thiel? If so, what do you think of their products?

I don't :(

misfit138
02-11-2010, 06:53 PM
I guess you missed the first part of the forum, I'm saying if all things being equal, materials crossovers etc. For example there are speakers that give you the option of coax and component placement of the tweeters. These are exactly the same speakers, so what is the reason you would place the tweeters away from the woofers. I realize if your speakers go in the door or some weird place its good to have the tweeters facing you, but lets assume thats not a problem.

I didn't miss a thing. You asked a question and I provided an answer. If you want to know the benefits of mounting tweeters on axis, it's a topic that's been discussed at length by people way more intelligent than you or I. Perform a google search and do some reading...

thisandthat
02-12-2010, 06:59 PM
Well when I said,
"All things being equal, cross over, tweeter, and woofer, is there any advantage to getting a component over a coax other then the flexibility of woofer/tweeter placement."
And you said
"Component speakers are often made with better materials, handle more power, have superior crossovers and produce better midbass than coaxials."

So I'm not sure how I could make myself anymore clear, I was trying to say if I took two identical sets of speakers, the ONLY difference being the placement of the tweeters. I realize that in a car it is very beneficial in lots of cases to have tweeters in a different location then the woofer, but I want to assume for a min that this also wasn't an issue.
Simply I'm asking is there a disadvantage acoustically to having the tweeters inside the woofer. Which to my understanding has nothing to do with on or off axis placement (lets say in both scenarios the tweeters are facing straight at your face).

Thanks for the input everyone

thisandthat
02-12-2010, 07:05 PM
He meant the "home speakers don't use coaxials" part :) His point was that some do. Heck, my current speakers don't even have tweeters or a crossover of any kind, but that's a separate issue :p:

Fair enough, I guess I should have said, "for the most part....."

I thought I answered this? It's because of the compromises in speaker mounting in a vehicle...to get a coherent stereo image, it often takes things that are backwards logically that you'd never do at home, like putting tweeters on a different axis than the midbasses. With coaxes, you're locked into on-axis mounting both at the same time, which may or may not be practical.



I don't :(

Fair enough, I guess I should have said, "for the most part....."

Ok lets say you had a two home speakers, one with a coax one with a tweeter directly above the woofer, does the tweeter in front of the woofer change the sound? I know the radiation pattern will be slightly different, but will there be any other things that come up?

misfit138
02-12-2010, 07:08 PM
Simply I'm asking is there a disadvantage acoustically to having the tweeters inside the woofer. Which to my understanding has nothing to do with on or off axis placement.

ugh...

misfit138
02-12-2010, 07:10 PM
Click the thanks button for me. :)

spltuscon
02-12-2010, 07:11 PM
Having the tweeters "inside the woofer" can sound very good, its called point source and it basically means that all the sound is coming from the same center and distance from you. Normally in a car you can position the components seperately to achieve better sound, but I've heard situations where coaxials with outboard crossovers sounded quite good.

thisandthat
02-13-2010, 06:47 AM
Having the tweeters "inside the woofer" can sound very good, its called point source and it basically means that all the sound is coming from the same center and distance from you. Normally in a car you can position the components seperately to achieve better sound, but I've heard situations where coaxials with outboard crossovers sounded quite good.

Thats what I was thinking, I wanted to see if anyone here though that having a tweeter impeding (in the way of) the woofer would make a difference or the tweeter would have some sort strange reflection off of the woofer.

Thanks for input

Eugenics
02-13-2010, 09:55 AM
There are a few companies that offer a coax mount on their components which would allow you more options.