PDA

View Full Version : ATTN: 80inches and other 4th order experts



SHiZNiLTi
03-06-2009, 05:42 PM
I'm getting ready to start a new build for my Lexus GS300.

I want to build a 4th order ported through the factory 10" sub cutout hole in the rear deck using a 10" tube as a port from home deport or a square port.

I need some help in creating a 4th order enclosure.

Post up some rough numbers of different chamber sizes so I can get an idea of where to start.

I've got about 4 cubes to work with.... 30 width x 12 height x 24 depth

I've got 1500rms to work with, I haven't decided on what sub/s to use. I was thinking of using a couple of 10's or a single 12, let me know what you think would be a perfect match for the 1500rms I've got to work with.

Here's a few pics of the ride, I'll get more pics of the trunk later today...

http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/9018/frontmyspacepw7.jpg

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/6176/lx1wx1.jpg

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/7969/lx2kz3.jpg

SHiZNiLTi
03-06-2009, 05:42 PM
Here's some quick some quick 30 second sketches I made of a couple different ideas on the design, let me know which one would work better. I've seen alot of people with blow throughs use the box where the subs face each other...

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/205/94243693.jpg

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/1127/56858027.jpg

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/8128/45807267.jpg

jdawg
03-06-2009, 05:58 PM
you almost HAVE to have specs for a bp. 1 15? Might work but really you need t/s parameters to work it up. I did one the other day playing around with 2 re se15's and it came out to about 13cubes. Maybe a couple 10s

Unfortunate
03-06-2009, 06:11 PM
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/9018/frontmyspacepw7.jpg

Nice Ride.

SHiZNiLTi
03-06-2009, 06:18 PM
A single 15" would be too tall for the box to fit. I'm looking at a 12" Fi BTL or the new XCON, it would work with the design on the left pictured above...

Fs: 39.3 Hz | 37.9 Hz
Re: 0.7 Ohms/coil | 1.4 Ohms/coil
Qms: 5.09 | 5.28
Qes: .21 | .20
Qts: .20 | .19
Mms: 206g | 222g
Sd: 480cm^2 | 480cm^2
Vas: 25.7 l | 25.7 l
Spl: 90.5dB 1W/1m | 90.3dB 1W/1m
Bl: 18.3 N/A | 27.2 N/A
Xmax: 28mm * | 28mm *
Rms: 2000W * | 2000W *
Sealed box: N/A cuft | N/A cuft
Ported box: 1.75-3cuft | 1.75-3cuft
Sub OD: 12.500” | 12.500”
Cut ID: 11.125” | 11.125”
Mounting depth: 7.250” | 7.250”
Displacement: 0.18cuft | 0.18cuft

jdawg
03-06-2009, 07:16 PM
which specs? dual1 or dual2?

jdawg
03-06-2009, 07:25 PM
i did the dual 2 and it doesnt model out very good at all the f3 is 97 hz on the recomended setting and moving tuning down the decreases output a whole lot, does the xcon have specs yet?

jdawg
03-06-2009, 07:27 PM
i thought gmonk had btls in a bandpass, maybe ask him about his box

SHiZNiLTi
03-06-2009, 07:36 PM
i did the dual 2 and it doesnt model out very good at all the f3 is 97 hz on the recomended setting and moving tuning down the decreases output a whole lot, does the xcon have specs yet?
I'll have to check with mark for the XCON specs. I didn't see them on the website. Thats good to know about the BTL, I was gonna go for a 2ohm load on the amp, so dual 1 ohm for a single 12.

If I decide to not go with a single 12, I'll get (2) 10" Mach 5 IXL IXL-10.2.2's, looks like a great sub and the price is decent, how do you think that would work out...

http://www.mach5audio.com/zen/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=65&products_id=187

T/S Parameters
Fs = 27.8 Hz
Re = 3.7 Ohms
Qes = 0.46
Qms = 6.44
Qts = 0.43
Mms = 234.1 g
Rms = 6.34 kg/s
Cms = 0.14 mm/N
VAS = 13.9 litres
Sd = 265.9 cm2
Xmax = 20 mm

jdawg
03-06-2009, 07:52 PM
it looks alot better the f3 is about 30hz but im getting .7 cubes total for the whole box, im still messin with bandpasses in bb6 so maybe im doing something wrong

SHiZNiLTi
03-06-2009, 08:07 PM
Im gonna try some of the online 4th order calculators and see what happens.

I'll post link and results.

jdawg
03-06-2009, 08:11 PM
http://www.carstereo.com/help/Articles.cfm?id=27

strong*I*bumpin
03-06-2009, 08:42 PM
Im gonna try some of the online 4th order calculators and see what happens.

I'll post link and results.

what ever u go with please treat that Lexus right

galacticmonkey
03-06-2009, 11:05 PM
I can help you with a bandpass for the 12. PM me.

SHiZNiLTi
03-07-2009, 06:52 AM
This guy in the Impala had good luck with his 4th order ported through rear deck...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhPCC5pkUDM

I allways like watching Frankie's Lexus GS300 Flex.

I showed these vids to the guys on clublexus forums and they freaked out, they didn't know what real bass was...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQB4PW3tWew
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYqIqdiaz_o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hOMvsewtDA

iamamp3pimp
03-07-2009, 07:11 AM
its not a 4th order though

not anymore anyway, just a regular clamshell now...

SHiZNiLTi
03-09-2009, 05:35 PM
http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/4509/4thordermach510s.jpg

4th order for (2) 10" Mach 5 IXL IXL-10.2.2's...

http://www.mach5audio.com/zen/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=65&products_id=187

T/S Parameters
Fs = 27.8 Hz
Re = 3.7 Ohms
Qes = 0.46
Qms = 6.44
Qts = 0.43
Mms = 234.1 g
Rms = 6.34 kg/s
Cms = 0.14 mm/N
VAS = 13.9 litres
Sd = 265.9 cm2
Xmax = 20 mm

For the VAS I converted from Litres to ft3 because the "Fourth-Order Bandpass Subwoofer Enclosure Design Calculator" on carstereo.com uses ft3, not litres, is this correct?

Here is the program I'm using...
http://www.carstereo.com/help/Articles.cfm?id=27

1 liter = 0.0353 ft3

VAS is 13 liters x .0353 = .49ft3

I entered in all the T/S Parameters and set the F3L to 31hz so my range would be 31hz-77hz +2.41db.

It's saying the Vf(front ported section) of the box should be .35cuft tuned to Fb 49hz and the Vr (rear sealed section) of the box should be .46cuft. And this is for (2) subs, doesn't this seem way too small?

The F3 was at 47hz, but it gave the setup too much gain @ +14db so I brought it down to 31hz and that gave the setup +2.41db and also gave me a better Passband at 31hz-77hz.

Please help and check these numbers. This 4th order just seems way too small @ .81 cuft total for (2) 10's

jdawg
03-09-2009, 05:41 PM
I didnt save the design i came up with but thats about what i got and i thought it was too small too, i just went off of the 'optimum' setting not adding any gain or anything

80INCHES
03-09-2009, 05:48 PM
Im Just Now C-ing This Thread
Dont Do The Sup Facing Each Other
Get Either 2 Niteshade 12's Or Ia Flatlyine Or Mach 5 Spl 12's Or Fi Q12's Or Ss Rlp-12's
They All Will Work Well With The Dimensin U Have..if U Can Get 14 High Ur Golden
Hit Me Up And I Will Give U Details

And The Round 10'' Sonotue Is Perfect
80

jdawg
03-09-2009, 05:52 PM
i want to see the design :fyi: 80, what prog you use?

SHiZNiLTi
03-09-2009, 06:08 PM
80INCHES due to my height limitations which is caused by the hole opening of my trunk I'm gonna have to do (2) 10" subs to keep the height down. Probably will go with (2) 10" Mach 5 IXL's. This system isn't going to be anywhere close to my BTL setup, but thats ok, I just want a clean soundin setup with decent output with no trunk rattle. I might be able to fit (4) 10's though, we will have to see what the actual box size would be for the (2) 10's.

Ya the 10" sono tube is what I was planning on using if I was to use a 10" tube...
http://www.bracingsystems.com/images/products/large/Sonotube.jpg

I might be able to get away with using just a single 6" flared precision port for the 10's though...
http://www.parts-express.com/images/item_standard/268-354_s.jpg

30x12x24 are the new max dimensions I want to use...
http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8132/maxdims.th.jpg (http://img16.imageshack.us/my.php?image=maxdims.jpg)

80INCHES
03-09-2009, 07:55 PM
i want to see the design :fyi: 80, what prog you use?
i dont use any programs...i only use my head and a calculator

to shiz... use 2 tens....u would **** urself if u use the design im thinking...
80

iamamp3pimp
03-09-2009, 09:47 PM
80 inches for the win.

momuzykent
03-09-2009, 09:52 PM
80 is the 4th order guru!

galacticmonkey
03-09-2009, 10:12 PM
For the 2 10s go with 1.4 sealed and 2 ported. Use a single flared 6" aero tuned to 45hz.

soundsolutions
03-10-2009, 07:39 AM
12" SSA XCON Specs
Re 3.7 Ohms (1.85 per coil wired in series)
Fs 32.4 Hz
Qms 5.24
Qes .39
Qts .37
Mms 222
Vas 35 l
Sd 480 cm^2
BL 20.65
SPL 86.7 1 W/1m

Hope this helps.

SHiZNiLTi
03-12-2009, 05:06 PM
Well after thinking it over, it's just gonna be too hard fit a 12" due to height limitations.

I've decided to get the following, I will be ordering it 03/16/09.

Let me know if you think I'm making the right decision, all products are BNIB and the prices seem decent, no shipping cost and no tax...

* Hifonics BXi1608D
* (2) 10" RE SE D4's
* Kicker 1/0 gauge dual amp kit

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/6349/mychoices.jpg

jdawg
03-12-2009, 10:37 PM
spring about $40 more and get a bxi2008d