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IDSkoT
02-18-2008, 03:40 AM
I think my HU is clipping at 65%

I have a Pioneer DEH-P6900UB.

The thing is, volumes 1-20 are basically garbage and give no real volume. It only starts getting to actual sound at around 25-30, and kinda loud at 35, but by the time it's 40 it's blaring, and I'm pretty sure clipping. The volume goes to 62, and how it is now most of the time I keep it at 37-ish.
But, is that normal? I did the math, it's about 65% @ 40, and I'm pretty sure it's clipping because once it reaches 40 it sounds like absolute garbage. Unless I've been uninformed on HU clipping.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:21 PM
Not sure about that particular model....I have the Premier P-780MP and it still isn't clipping at 45 (that's what number I used to set my gains).

If you're sure it's clipping that early then back it off until it stops clipping and use that number to set your gains...you should still reach full power on your amps...will just be a little sooner on the volume dial.

While I like the sound of the Pioneer HU's I'm not real impressed with their uniformity...(My current P780-MP is not a 4volt preout...it's only a 2volt for some reason...last one I had was...same amps, different gain setting with same DMM...WTF is up with that?)

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:26 PM
If you are running the mids and highs off the deck and an amp for the sub then you are probably clipping the signal to the mids and highs trying to overcome the bass.Turn the bass down so its not so loud and you won't need to turn it up as loud.

Techchild
02-18-2008, 12:28 PM
My poineer goes up to 50 without distortain, what speakers are you running?

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:30 PM
It sounds like a gain setting problem more then the head unit itself.

groundpound4200
02-18-2008, 12:31 PM
i set all my PIoneer HUs at 45/62.... never got any distortion with 3 different models

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:31 PM
Pioneers clip @ full volume, set your gains @ 61/62.

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:34 PM
Pioneers clip @ full volume, set your gains @ 61/62.

this true? i have never gone over 48 on mine:confused:

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:35 PM
Yes, I confirmed it with an oscope.

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:36 PM
^^^Mine sound pretty **** clear up to 50 but I've never gone to 60.

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:37 PM
Yes, I confirmed it with an oscope.

saweet

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:37 PM
so what is the difference in setting it at 61/62 or 45/62...if you use a DMM or something to set your amp aren't you still going to get a full power unclipped signal?

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:37 PM
Yes, I confirmed it with an oscope.

thanks for the info!That is a good piece of information to know....:veryhapp:

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:38 PM
so what is the difference in setting it at 61/62 or 45/62...if you use a DMM or something to set your amp aren't you still going to get a full power unclipped signal?

the gain knob on the amp will not be as high

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:38 PM
Are the Pioneer Hu's like the Alpine subwoofer setting....I'm not getting 4 volts out of my P780-MP (I can tell by where the DMM wants me to set the gains on my amps).

Just curious

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:39 PM
so what is the difference in setting it at 61/62 or 45/62...if you use a DMM or something to set your amp aren't you still going to get a full power unclipped signal?

He probably has the bass set to high so he has to turn the volume up to make the highs clear enough to hear.But since the bass is so high when he gets to 40 it is distorted not clipped.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:40 PM
the gain knob on the amp will not be as high


I realize that...but is there any real difference? I mean if you have nice amps you shouldn't clip either way...and the volume wouldn't really be any louder, right (although the number on the HU would be)

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:40 PM
so what is the difference in setting it at 61/62 or 45/62...if you use a DMM or something to set your amp aren't you still going to get a full power unclipped signal?
Why not be able to use the actual amount of volume allotted? :confused:

Lower volume setting would just mean louder @ higher volume with a chance for potential distortion, also a higher gain setting that may allow floor noise, but not always.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:42 PM
any chance you did some testing on the RCA outputs while you were playing with your Pioneer HU?

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:43 PM
that's what I did.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:44 PM
Why not be able to use the actual amount of volume allotted? :confused:

Lower volume setting would just mean louder @ higher volume with a chance for potential distortion, also a higher gain setting that may allow floor noise, but not always.


Never thought about the floor noise....I will reset my gains with the volume quite a bit higher and see if it makes any difference...only annoyance for me would be turning the volume knob for a longer period of time to get the volume down before I enter the neighborhood (not that bad of an annoyance really)

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:44 PM
I have check my rca for voltage which claimed 4 preout.But I never got above 1.7v out of it.

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:45 PM
that's what the attenuator(sp?) is for

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:45 PM
that's what I did.


I mean any chance you tested the voltage output to make sure it was 2 or 4 volts (or whatever your model number states)

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:46 PM
that's what the attenuator(sp?) is for


I usually don't turn it down unless I'm going home for the day....don't want the attenuator on when I shut the truck off....like I said, not really an annoyance

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:47 PM
I have check my rca for voltage which claimed 4 preout.But I never got above 1.7v out of it.

AVIC-N1

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:47 PM
no, ever since I got an oscope, I stopped using the DMM. Oscope more accurate, but I'm sure it was around 1.9-2.1v on mine. DEH-P3800

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:48 PM
I know the Alpine sub outs are variable....but do most manufacturer's also make the RCA's variable so that you have to turn them just below clipping to get the full voltage out of them?

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:49 PM
no, ever since I got an oscope, I stopped using the DMM. Oscope more accurate, but I'm sure it was around 1.9-2.1v on mine. DEH-P3800

dmm testing of rca is ac, shielding to center pole?

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:49 PM
most are like that, some never clip.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:49 PM
O-scope would be nice....but $$$

You ever test a Kenwood Exceleon for the volume before clipping?

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:50 PM
dmm testing of rca is ac, shielding to center pole?
VAC yes, 0dB 1kHz tones, 0dB 40Hz on the subout.

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:50 PM
VAC yes, 0dB 1kHz tones, 0dB 40Hz on the subout.

thanks, wasn't sure

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:51 PM
O-scope would be nice....but $$$

:confused:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Velleman-HPS10SE-2MHz-Personal-Scope-10MS-s-NEW_W0QQitemZ330211552486QQihZ014QQcategoryZ104247 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

You ever test a Kenwood Exceleon for the volume before clipping?[/quote]Nope.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:51 PM
dmm testing of rca is ac, shielding to center pole?


Lost me on that one....can you explain in a little further detail?

audioarsonal
02-18-2008, 12:53 PM
I know the Alpine sub outs are variable....but do most manufacturer's also make the RCA's variable so that you have to turn them just below clipping to get the full voltage out of them?

I haven't seen any decks that had varible RCA outs for front and rear only on the sub channel.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:53 PM
:confused:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Velleman-HPS10SE-2MHz-Personal-Scope-10MS-s-NEW_W0QQitemZ330211552486QQihZ014QQcategoryZ104247 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

You ever test a Kenwood Exceleon for the volume before clipping?Nope.[/QUOTE]


No ****? Only $129? Most decent DMM's cost more than that

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:54 PM
Is that the one you have? Hard to use or pretty self-explanatory?

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:56 PM
Yes, it's what I use and is accurate. hook it up and press 'auto' the thing does the work for you.

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:56 PM
Lost me on that one....can you explain in a little further detail?

when you test voltage on rca's, you have to place one probe on the shielding and the other on the center pole, and read vac on the dmm

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:57 PM
Yes, it's what I use and is accurate. hook it up and press 'auto' the thing does the work for you.


And you just play your test tones and set the gains and it'll let you know when clipping occurs?

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:57 PM
yes

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 12:58 PM
Well I was shopping for a new DMM....guess I'll get this instead.

So even a semi-dummy like me can use it properly, huh?

dman4486
02-18-2008, 12:59 PM
Well I was shopping for a new DMM....guess I'll get this instead.

So even a semi-dummy like me can use it properly, huh?

haha....if you can push the auto button:D

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 12:59 PM
idiot proof

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 01:00 PM
I can push a button pretty well, most of the time, was more referring to reading it right so I know when it's clipping or not

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 01:01 PM
idiot proof


Thanks...way to put the pressure on me :)

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 01:03 PM
lol sorry. Just keep it away from cold temperatures.

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 01:03 PM
Okay....so I think I'll but the Velleman HPS10SE

ProgMtl
02-18-2008, 01:04 PM
lol sorry. Just keep it away from cold temperatures.


I live in San Diego....shouldn't be a problem...most days

ultimate157
02-18-2008, 05:57 PM
Pioneers clip @ full volume, set your gains @ 61/62.

x2. Confirmed with O-scope. Perfect @ 61, clipped at 62.

JeffM
02-18-2008, 07:29 PM
Why not be able to use the actual amount of volume allotted? :confused:

Lower volume setting would just mean louder @ higher volume with a chance for potential distortion, also a higher gain setting that may allow floor noise, but not always.

I have my gain set with the volume at 45, And I hear a Static/hissing noise in the background when no music is playing or on a vocal song. Is this what you call floor noise? I noticed before that the only way to get rid of this noise was to lower the gain. So should I raise the volume to 55 or so, while setting the gain at a lower level?

budahbuddy803
02-18-2008, 07:32 PM
i set all my amps with my pioneer hu at 55/62 when i get really crazy i will go to 60/62 but will not ride like that for long

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 07:57 PM
I have my gain set with the volume at 45, And I hear a Static/hissing noise in the background when no music is playing or on a vocal song. Is this what you call floor noise? I noticed before that the only way to get rid of this noise was to lower the gain. So should I raise the volume to 55 or so, while setting the gain at a lower level?yes that is the noise floor you hear.

IDSkoT
02-18-2008, 10:11 PM
I have CDT E-61's with TW-25 Tweeters running off a JBL GTO75.4 II [104x4 @ 40ohm].

With the gains set at 61, what volume do you guys normally listen to it around? 'cause, I just find it strange that I have to put it up to like 60% just for it to be enjoyable.

I guess I have to reset my gains at 61. Should I do it by ear or just wait 'till I can use a DMM which'll be in a week or so? Maybe more.

DBfan187
02-18-2008, 10:15 PM
34-45

though I use a 3:1 ratio, I set my amps gains with -10dB tones. Sounds **** good!

dman4486
02-20-2008, 12:42 PM
thanks to db and ultimate for the info on the pioneer o-scope readings, i am way happier with the sound of my system now that it is tuned at 61:D

Puggsley456
02-22-2008, 01:51 PM
Theres some really usefull knowledge in here guys good work.


Anyone got any similar ideas on what to expect from eclipse? Namely the 7K??