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mile098
12-09-2007, 10:15 AM
http://img6.pictiger.com/bda/13359146_th.jpg (http://mile098.pictiger.com/images/13359146/)

edit: kindly request that the mods add an 'e' in my thread title next to 'on'..thank u

hoss
12-09-2007, 10:19 AM
would you care to tell us what we are looking at? that might help answer the question :)

if these are response curves, both look like the back end of a donkey.

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:21 AM
yes they are response curves, both slightly altered from the manufacturors recommendations cuz they were off and the peak was too much....the white one is the present, the blue one is smthg im thinking

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:25 AM
yea, the white one is vented the blue one 4th order bandpass

hoss
12-09-2007, 10:29 AM
still need some more details man... is this an SPL install or daily install?

i still say they look like absolute crap... not to mention that you should only be using winisd to get a slight idea of the results, and after that you should immediatly forget everything that winisd tells you.

skadude016
12-09-2007, 10:29 AM
so you would rather have a peaky 50-60hz instead of a smooth curve?

plus I have found just beacause it models up that way doesnt mean thats the way its going to go in car.

squeak9798
12-09-2007, 10:31 AM
both look like the back end of a donkey.

:word:



What is your goal ?

hoss
12-09-2007, 10:32 AM
where are you seeing a smooth curve? :eyebrow:

he has a curve thats about 5db up at 50Hz, and another that is about 8-9Db up at nearly 70Hz...

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:33 AM
a smoth curve is not an option for this driver cuz it has a 24bd/otc drop at 50 anyways(vented) and a 12 db/oct in sealed..the vented version plays good on the 36mafia and all that **** tho, just thought id try the bandpass

yes its a peaky 50-60 Hz but wheres the point in tunning a bandpass lower?

skadude016
12-09-2007, 10:34 AM
where are you seeing a smooth curve? :eyebrow:

he has a curve thats about 5db up at 50Hz, and another that is about 8-9Db up at nearly 70Hz...

ok in relation to the curve that seems to look like everest. :laugh:

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:34 AM
the goal is depth...as loud as possible on low freq

and if someone has any thoughts in terms of doing it different, they will be appreciated

skadude016
12-09-2007, 10:35 AM
the goal is depth...as loud as possible on low freq

so put it in a large ported enclosure tuned low... you would probably have a better chance at getting it right the first time with this.

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:37 AM
its already in a 52 liter box tuned to 33...would a bandpass enclosure add some loudness to the lows? if so im open to suggestions

skadude016
12-09-2007, 10:38 AM
what woofer is this?

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:39 AM
jbl p1222

skadude016
12-09-2007, 10:42 AM
jbl p1222
55 liters is only 2 cu. ft. may want to try 70 liters maybe 85 liters. tuned to 32hz or so. also the response has alot to do with your vehicle.

IamDeMan
12-09-2007, 10:44 AM
a smoth curve is not an option for this driver cuz it has a 24bd/otc drop at 50 anyways(vented) and a 12 db/oct in sealed..the vented version plays good on the 36mafia and all that **** tho, just thought id try the bandpass

yes its a peaky 50-60 Hz but wheres the point in tunning a bandpass lower?Seal it. With a 12db rolloff and added cabin gain, you will get a more realistic response than the abomination you have up there.

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:47 AM
sealing it makes me lose the pressure i want from it...dont care much about SQ as i do for the groundpound effekt on teh rap ****...i got it exclusivly for that

IamDeMan
12-09-2007, 10:51 AM
sealing it makes me lose the pressure i want from it...dont care much about SQ as i do for the groundpound effekt on teh rap ****...i got it exclusivly for that

Well if it doesn't extend low, you won't get retarded "ground punding". None of the options you have explained will give you this. Their rolloffs are too high and steep. They will get some SPL, but not at low frequencies. May I suggest you get a woofer more geared to what you want then. Because if this is the responses it is producing then it looks like a sealed candidate.

BTW not caring about SQ is fairly retarded IMO unless you compete.


EDIT: the woofer has an EBP of 50. Like I said, it is a sealed woofer. If you wanna pound the ground buy 3 more LOL.

hoss
12-09-2007, 10:53 AM
sealing it makes me lose the pressure i want from it...dont care much about SQ as i do for the groundpound effekt on teh rap ****...i got it exclusivly for that
up it to 4 cubes @ 37Hz. that should give you a slight peak and lower your bass shelf a good bit. it should play well with your vehicles transfer function as well.

i would just ditch the bandpass idea. those response graphs are truly awful that you had their. you could try a 6th order bandpass, that might be able to give you a high peak and some better LFE, but i dont have any experience with those so i cant offer any suggestions.

skadude016
12-09-2007, 10:55 AM
Well if it doesn't extend low, you won't get retarded "ground punding". None of the options you have explained will give you this. Their rolloffs are too high and steep. They will get some SPL, but not at low frequencies. May I suggest you get a woofer more geared to what you want then. Because if this is the responses it is producing then it looks like a sealed candidate.

BTW not caring about SQ is fairly retarded IMO unless you compete.
x2.

skadude016
12-09-2007, 10:57 AM
6th order BP. is really hit or miss. you either get real lucky with the design (the 1% of the guys out there) or you build and build and build until you get what you want. if you do go a bandpass route i would highly suggest aeroports so you can trim or add on port if needed.

mile098
12-09-2007, 10:57 AM
Well if it doesn't extend low, you won't get retarded "ground punding". None of the options you have explained will give you this. Their rolloffs are too high and steep. They will get some SPL, but not at low frequencies. May I suggest you get a woofer more geared to what you want then. Because if this is the responses it is producing then it looks like a sealed candidate.

BTW not caring about SQ is fairly retarded IMO unless you compete.

had Mb quart RWE and PWE both, probably the best sounding subs ive ever heard, but since im a 22 year old punk they dont fulfill my needs for spl...this as someone said may not reflect how the sub actually plays tho cuz it does get low, really low, just wanna see if it can do even better...sealed curve doesnt look promising to me even from the manufacturer or the one that win isd gives me...

mile098
12-09-2007, 11:00 AM
6th order bandpass is smthg i wouldnt even know where to begin, have much more reading to do before venturing into smthg like the..ill try a bigger box or the 4th orderbandpass and play with port lengths

skadude016
12-09-2007, 11:00 AM
had Mb quart RWE and PWE both, probably the best sounding subs ive ever heard, but since im a 22 year old punk they dont fulfill my needs for spl...this as someone said may not reflect how the sub actually plays tho cuz it does get low, really low, just wanna see if it can do even better...sealed curve doesnt look promising to me even from the manufacturer or the one that win isd gives me...

ya but your not getting it man lol. this is in a trunk correct? that curve is so far from what you would be seeing from a trunk car. They act very different. i remember when I had 2 no name 12's sealed on about 200 watts and it would shake the rear window glass from 25-30hz. every vehicle is different

IamDeMan
12-09-2007, 11:05 AM
After modeling it myself, you can get what you want to an extent by doing 3 cu ft or more. It shifts the peak to the mid 30s to low 40. Thats more of a basshead alignment than peaking at 50-60 IMO. 50-60 is for pure SPL only.

IamDeMan
12-09-2007, 11:07 AM
up it to 4 cubes @ 37Hz. that should give you a slight peak and lower your bass shelf a good bit. it should play well with your vehicles transfer function as well.

i would just ditch the bandpass idea. those response graphs are truly awful that you had their. you could try a 6th order bandpass, that might be able to give you a high peak and some better LFE, but i dont have any experience with those so i cant offer any suggestions.
4 cubes would be really ideal for what he really wants, along with a port that has a lot of area, but he can get respectably within his goal in 3 cu ft as well.

I still maintain my bottomline that you would be better suited with a different woofer, but carry on with your mission.

skadude016
12-09-2007, 11:07 AM
After modeling it myself, you can get what you want to an extent by doing 3 cu ft or more. It shifts the peak to the mid 30s to low 40. Thats more of a basshead alignment than peaking at 50-60 IMO. 50-60 is for pure SPL only.

not to mention would sound horrid on music

mile098
12-09-2007, 11:09 AM
so ure all thinking a 70-80 liter vented if im not misteken?

skadude016
12-09-2007, 11:11 AM
so ure all thinking a 70-80 liter vented if im not misteken?

ya would probably breathe alot better and have a nicer low end

mile098
12-09-2007, 11:14 AM
ill give it a go then, and see where im at..thnx guys

edit: port area suggestions maybe? JBL says 102 mm in diameter but that strikes me as too little...

IamDeMan
12-09-2007, 11:15 AM
ya would probably breathe alot better and have a nicer low end
X2

Still inflated and not my cup of tea, but it will give you more of what you want I think. "pounding" and "rumble" isn't given by SPL alone. It has to have some extension.

IamDeMan
12-09-2007, 11:21 AM
ill give it a go then, and see where im at..thnx guys

edit: port area suggestions maybe? JBL says 102 mm in diameter but that strikes me as too little...

85 liters or more actually tuned to 33-35. 75 is still only 2.6 cu ft.

As far as port try 2 102 MM diameter ports if doing round. If Slotting then 200MM squared.