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Bennypoo69
09-15-2007, 05:02 PM
Okay... I have a 2002 Honda Civic EX coupe. I listen to a lot of different things but mostly music with a lot of bass.. I have (2) JL audio 12W6 with a JL audio 500/1 Amp and its pretty loud so Im looking for something that I will be able to hear over them. I have no more than $200 per set. I have a profile AP1040.. 75watts by 4.

I'm looking to fill my factory holes with a set of 6 1/2" component set, but i would also like to have a kick panel pod made and have a set in them as well. About that pod would it be better to go with the 6 1/2'' or the 5 1/4'' set the the kick panels? I know that the 5 1/4'' would make the pod alittle less bulky but the 6 1/2" would be louder, right? I have 6"x 9" in the rear and I was just playing on upgrading them with a better set. The same brand of componets so everything matches.

I was thinking about JL audio TR series, Infinity kappa series, Or the Alpine SPr 17s. Im looking for something loud. So that not only can i hear the bass down the street but the music as well. Any suggestions would be great THank you

crow
09-15-2007, 05:55 PM
My advice is to scrap the idea of running two sets of components up front. Combine the money you would have spent on them and buy one really nice set for the front. One set of components with a properly matched amp is capable of getting very loud.

Another idea is to go with one set of components in the kicks and a set of midbasses for the doors.

DejaWiz
09-15-2007, 05:59 PM
^ agreed with getting only 1 set. What was your planned budget for both sets?

Bennypoo69
09-15-2007, 09:06 PM
I thought that getting the two sets would be better and would be able to get louder than just one because there would be more cone area, more speakers, and a louder sound.. I guess i'm a newbe....

Okay, so with that... For around $450-$500 (since i figured about 200 per set for the two) so what would the loudest component speaker set that i could get? And would i still be able to use that amp (Profile AP1040)? If not what amp would you suggest that would match well with it, that would be around $200 or so.

Thanks.

DejaWiz
09-15-2007, 09:36 PM
Your amp should be fine bridged (about 2x200-210w rms).

And with that kind of power, one set would get plenty loud and not to mention keep the soundstaging and imaging up front.

You have a fairly decent budget for speakers, so there's lots of options.

Rainbow Powerline CMX 265 Kick for around $330
Polk SR6500 for $500 (if you can find them in stock online)
Memphis MSQ6
Pioneer TS-C720PRS
Zapco CK-165
PPI 356cs
Focal K2P
Infinity Perfect 6.1

...to name just a few.

Bennypoo69
09-15-2007, 10:07 PM
Okay, I don't like that harsh ear peircing sound that comes from the tweeters, I like to have it set so i hear it slighty but be able to turn it all the way up and still not have it bother me. So, knowing that, could you narrow down to like 2 or 3 possiblites.

thanks

DejaWiz
09-15-2007, 10:17 PM
Polks or Pioneers.

Bennypoo69
09-15-2007, 10:23 PM
Okay, I went looking online at the Pioneer TS-C720PRS and they seem good. I found them for $240. One question though is that they say that they are 50watts rms and my amp is 75watts rms so can i just turn the gain down and that will work, correct? Okay now since that they are only $240 for the pair, so with my left over cash would it be good to get another set or spend it on something else? If something else, what?

Thanks

DejaWiz
09-15-2007, 10:25 PM
They'll easily take 120-150w rms as long as it's clean (non distorted, non-clipped) power. Just set the gains for that and they'll sound awesome.

I auditioned them running off a Premier ICE 2 channel amp at 150w per channel. Sonic bliss!

SRim23
09-15-2007, 10:34 PM
Okay... I have a 2002 Honda Civic EX coupe. I listen to a lot of different things but mostly music with a lot of bass.. I have (2) JL audio 12W6 with a JL audio 500/1 Amp and its pretty loud so Im looking for something that I will be able to hear over them. I have no more than $200 per set. I have a profile AP1040.. 75watts by 4.

I'm looking to fill my factory holes with a set of 6 1/2" component set, but i would also like to have a kick panel pod made and have a set in them as well. About that pod would it be better to go with the 6 1/2'' or the 5 1/4'' set the the kick panels? I know that the 5 1/4'' would make the pod alittle less bulky but the 6 1/2" would be louder, right? I have 6"x 9" in the rear and I was just playing on upgrading them with a better set. The same brand of componets so everything matches.

I was thinking about JL audio TR series, Infinity kappa series, Or the Alpine SPr 17s. Im looking for something loud. So that not only can i hear the bass down the street but the music as well. Any suggestions would be great THank you

i recently purchased the q logic kicks that house the 6.5 mid and i gotta tell you it doesnt leave much leg room. on the drivers side you lose your dead pedal and always have to keep your knee bent and your foot back.

if you were going with kicks id say 5.25

tbasile1
09-15-2007, 10:35 PM
Good speakers right there and they sound very nice!

(Pioneers that is)

Bennypoo69
09-15-2007, 10:42 PM
Thanks for the info on the kicks.... Okay, so should i get the two pairs.. One for the doors and the other for the kicks? 5.25 for the kicks and 6.5 for the doors? Both the Pioneer sets?

DejaWiz
09-15-2007, 10:44 PM
Start with doors only for now. You might be surprised how well they sound amply amped. If you still want more, then look into doing kicks.

thefunkybunch
09-16-2007, 12:48 AM
if you're wanting something that will get loud, and not lose it's composure, i'd recommend looking into a 3way setup. put the 6.5's in the doors, and the midrange and tweet in kickpanels. if you like JL's, the XR653 setup sounds great, and if you bridge that amp to each side, it should be sufficient power for them to sound great, and get very loud. more than enough to keep up with a pair of 12w6's. any other 3way setup of decent quality would keep up very well also. check out some of the dynaudio's, boston pro 6.53, and several other sets would suit you well.

Bennypoo69
09-17-2007, 06:53 PM
Okay, that sounds good with the 3-way setup. I just like the look and the way that the speakers sound when they are mounted in the kick panel, and this would be the way to do it. Now, the JL component set that was mentioned says that the RMS power handling is 70watts, and my amp is about 200watts RMS bridged.. Is there any other 3-way components that have that high of a power handling?

THanks

DejaWiz
09-17-2007, 07:14 PM
SLC 365 Kick (http://car.rainbow-audio.de/products/details.php?lan=2&pro=1&lin=7&art=231137) perhaps?

Bennypoo69
09-17-2007, 08:47 PM
Those look pretty nice. How about the Audiobahn ABC6003V? They have one of the highest RMS ratings of the ones that I have seen at 320watts RMS.

I have seen some bad and some good reviews about Audiobahn products but does anyone have any first hand experience with this set?

Thanks

tbasile1
09-17-2007, 09:00 PM
Rainbow>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Audio-crap

Dont get Audiobahn, their ratings are lies!!

Rainbow is 100% Better!!!!

DejaWiz
09-17-2007, 09:20 PM
I'd venture to say that Rainbow is 100,000% better than AudioBling crap. :D

Gary S
09-17-2007, 09:39 PM
If you can get them sealed with even a little air space in the kicks, that would be better than door speakers. Adding door speakers at that point would negate the good front soundstage and imaging kicks can give (unless you are going to add strickly midbass drivers to the doors to compliment kicks, but this is another topic... and even if the midbass drivers are crossed quite low, they may still degrade kick panel imaging).

If you can't get the speakers installed sealed and in rigid enclosures (which probably rules out q-forms unless they are highly modified/customized), one set in the doors is the next best thing.

As others have pointed out, don't do two sets up front... instead, buy one set of higher quality for your money.

Dejawiz has some great recommendations for speakers, can't go wrong with those. But for high power and a soft dome, Oz matrix would be good.

DejaWiz
09-17-2007, 10:22 PM
Yeah, definitely check into the OZ Matrix Elite (http://www.woofersetc.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=4717) set as well.

tbasile1
09-17-2007, 10:23 PM
I'd venture to say that Rainbow is 100,000% better than AudioBling crap. :D

wow what was I smoking, more like






100000000000000000000% better :graduate:

Gary S
09-17-2007, 11:09 PM
Show me an Audiobahn product and I'll show you a chromed cow patty.

DejaWiz
09-17-2007, 11:29 PM
^ Gary speaks the truth!

Bennypoo69
09-17-2007, 11:52 PM
Okay, No Go on the Audiobahn.. But has anyone listen to that particular component set or is everyone basing there hate for them over previous things they have listen to, or heard about them?

Okay, so my choice now is Oz audio, Focal, Polk, or CDT...

Lets say that they would be mounted in the Q-logic kick panel pods.. And I am just going with the 2way component set.

And my price range is around 450 or so..

What can play the loudest, and sound the best?

I want to be able to turn it up and go 2 streets over and be able to not only hear the bass (Which i can hear already) but be able to really hear the words as well, If thats even possible..

Thanks

DejaWiz
09-18-2007, 12:04 AM
Audiobahn is cheap, poor quality junk that only got popular through advertising and bling appeal.

With a budget of $450, I'd say the K2P's or the CMX265Kick's. I'd also say the Polk SR6500's, but those are pretty much an all out SQ set and won't be as midbass aggressive as the other two (although they'd still get decently loud).

thefunkybunch
09-18-2007, 11:24 PM
Okay, that sounds good with the 3-way setup. I just like the look and the way that the speakers sound when they are mounted in the kick panel, and this would be the way to do it. Now, the JL component set that was mentioned says that the RMS power handling is 70watts, and my amp is about 200watts RMS bridged.. Is there any other 3-way components that have that high of a power handling?

THanks

when you go with a decent speaker, power ratings are more for liability than anything else, really. for a long time i was running a set of TR-650csi speakers off of a jl 300/2. those speakers are rated at 50 watts RMS. i never had a single issue with them. i am a firm believer in overpowering. the more power you have on tap, the less your amplifier has to work to push the speakers. if you have a 500 watt amp pushing a 70 watt pair of speakers, the amp isn't even breaking a sweat, resulting in less heat, less strain on the amp, and better sound. if you have a 70 watt amp on a 70 watt pair of speakers, you're pushing that amp at its max to extract the full potential out of the speakers. would you rather go 100mph in a geo metro, or 100mph in a maybach mercedes?

having said that, jl also seriously underrates their power ratings. the w1v2 subs are 'rated' at 150 watts RMS. i've had customers push a single 10w1v2 with a 500/1 jl amp, beat the **** out of it, and never had a speaker failure. i'm not saying the jl's are the absolute greatest thing on earth, but for a good price range there isn't much in that price range that will sound better, without going DIY which may be a bit over your skill level, i know nothing of your background, but judging from your posts you'd probably be better off going with something that will do better otu of the box, without the need of a bunch of processing, highly customized install, etc to get it to sound right.

personally, i have a set of boston pro 6.53's and wouldn't trade them for, well, anything short of a set of the new boston Z's ;) those will handle anything you could ever possibly throw at them. they're 'rated' at 50-500 watts RMS. currently they're underpowered with an old ppi art amp, but when i get a few extra bucks, and a pdx 4.150 that will all change :D

thefunkybunch
09-18-2007, 11:27 PM
and if you're going with qlogic kickpanels, then get yourself a bucket of resin and some matting, and reinforce the holy **** out of the backside of them, or you'll never get the midbass you're looking for because the energy from the speaker goes to flexing the baffle they're mounted to, rather than producing sound. and if you want to go with a 2way set, i'd say boston pro's or spend a little more on the dynaudio system 240.

Gary S
09-19-2007, 03:42 AM
and if you're going with qlogic kickpanels, then get yourself a bucket of resin and some matting, and reinforce the holy **** out of the backside of them, or you'll never get the midbass you're looking for because the energy from the speaker goes to flexing the baffle they're mounted to, rather than producing sound. .


- I don't think even that would be enough... read what I said a few posts back. If you want to go with q-forms, look for a 3-way set, such as rainbow, so you can put the midbass driver in the doors and get some midbass.

thefunkybunch
09-19-2007, 09:24 PM
- I don't think even that would be enough... read what I said a few posts back. If you want to go with q-forms, look for a 3-way set, such as rainbow, so you can put the modbass driver in the doors and get some midbass.

i'd agree with you, however with reinforcement to the qforms they do a lot better than they do out of the box, and if someone doesn't have the skill to actually do it right and make it themselves, even a monkey could slap some glass onto the back of something that's already built. and i also agree with doing the 3way set with the midrange in the kicks with the tweet, and but the woofer in a heavily deadened door for best results. that is how i have it set up my my truck, and i couldn't be happier for a free set of speakers :D

kross
09-20-2007, 02:17 AM
I've never seen the Q-logic kick pods, but I remember reading somewhere that they aren't enclosed at all, that the back is totally open. If that's true, you would need to fabricate a back for it, otherwise you're just running your speakers free-air, which will totally negate all of your bass from those speakers.

Also, a few words about RMS ratings. No they are not for liability. A speaker that is rated for 50wrms can handle a signal of 50w continuous power for hours and hours on end. You have to remember that normal music has a crest factor of something in the neighborhood of 4 to 10. This means the average power of a song is only about 10%-40% of the maximum power. This means you can set your amplifier to deliver 200watts at maximum volume with a 0dB test tone, and when you listen to an average song at full volume, your speaker will see an average amount of power in the 20 to 80 watt range. That's what the RMS and peak ratings are on speakers. You can quite often set your amp to the peak rating of the speaker and be fine. See this thread, and look for responses by Manville Smith: http://www.audiogroupforum.com/csforum/showthread.php?t=4332

Also, I don't recommend a 3-way setup to someone without the expertise to properly set it up. Without the proper setup, a 3-way system will sound worse than a 2-way system.

DejaWiz
09-20-2007, 10:19 AM
Also, I don't recommend a 3-way setup to someone without the expertise to properly set it up. Without the proper setup, a 3-way system will sound worse than a pair of cheap coaxs.

fixed! :D

thefunkybunch
09-20-2007, 10:28 PM
I've never seen the Q-logic kick pods, but I remember reading somewhere that they aren't enclosed at all, that the back is totally open. If that's true, you would need to fabricate a back for it, otherwise you're just running your speakers free-air, which will totally negate all of your bass from those speakers.

Also, a few words about RMS ratings. No they are not for liability. A speaker that is rated for 50wrms can handle a signal of 50w continuous power for hours and hours on end. You have to remember that normal music has a crest factor of something in the neighborhood of 4 to 10. This means the average power of a song is only about 10%-40% of the maximum power. This means you can set your amplifier to deliver 200watts at maximum volume with a 0dB test tone, and when you listen to an average song at full volume, your speaker will see an average amount of power in the 20 to 80 watt range. That's what the RMS and peak ratings are on speakers. You can quite often set your amp to the peak rating of the speaker and be fine. See this thread, and look for responses by Manville Smith: http://www.audiogroupforum.com/csforum/showthread.php?t=4332

Also, I don't recommend a 3-way setup to someone without the expertise to properly set it up. Without the proper setup, a 3-way system will sound worse than a 2-way system.

agreed, i guess liability was the wrong choice of words. however, many manufacturers over-rate their speakers, as where jl audio, boston, rainbow, etc etc (higher end brands) tend to under-rate them, if anything. personally, i'd rather have twice as much power as i'll ever need, than just enough to get by.

and i agree that a 3way setup does need to be properly set up to sound it's best, but i'd still recommend one over a 2way setup simply because it is a better starting point. everyone has got to start learning somewhere :) at least he'd have a solid foundation to start on, and then learn from there by experimenting with different speaker placement options to make it sound great. a qlogic set, i agree is most definitely not the best place to start with, however with it just running a midrange driver, it's nt going to lose a lot of oomph by not being sealed in the back half. it's really not making any midbass at all really, most play from about 200hz at its lowest point (with a 4" midrange, most of them with the 3" dome start considerably higher than that). and as long as it is reinforced, they'll do fine. i really don't like putting woofers in kicks because it's not IB when they're not sealed, and if they are sealed it's usually way too small to do you any good, without doing an AP membrane outside the vehicle or something, which 99.9% of the people will not do. a heavily deadened door is the easiest place to put a woofer to get good sound.

pikers
09-24-2007, 01:31 AM
I'm looking to fill my factory holes with a set of 6 1/2" component set, but i would also like to have a kick panel pod made and have a set in them as well. About that pod would it be better to go with the 6 1/2'' or the 5 1/4'' set the the kick panels? I know that the 5 1/4'' would make the pod alittle less bulky but the 6 1/2" would be louder, right? I have 6"x 9" in the rear and I was just playing on upgrading them with a better set. The same brand of componets so everything matches.

You are a perfect candidate for a 3-way :eyebrow:.

What I mean is, fill that 6 1/2" door location with a solid midbass, and run kicks for mid/treble. This will also have the benefit of allowing you to get more bass upfront, allowing you to lower your crossover setting on your subs. This will reduce boom, and send more power to reproduce lower frequencies. The result will be a more well-rounded car, able to play a wider variety of music more accurately.

Add this as a +1 to what funkybunch said.