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View Full Version : Basic speaker choice for Loud sound



Biker
03-15-2007, 02:24 AM
I have tried just about everything to get loud hard pounding sound in my Dodge Dakota with little luck. My lows are covered. I have enough Bass in my 2 tens I can hardly keep my windows in but need some super loud mids and highs.

I started with Infinity perfects in the front rated at 100watts RMS and some Diamonds in the rear rated at 90watts rms. SQ was fantastic but I kept pushing the gains until I destroyed the front speakers.

I replaced the fronts with Diamond comps rated at 180 watts RMS and they were loud and the SQ was great but clipping got me again. now all my fronts and rears are blown.

With that said I want to start over. I will buy speakers and an amp if necessary to get loud sound and am not worried about quality.

Any sugestions?

Thanks
Biker

JimJ
03-15-2007, 02:25 AM
Compression horns...guarantee you will go deaf before you blow them :)

XanderMoser
03-15-2007, 02:27 AM
What amp, if any, are you using? If you're using HU power, the problem is most likely that you're clipping on the head unit and destroying the speakers because they aren't meant to play a clipped signal. I'm guessing the problem isn't the speakers.

DaveDSMer
03-15-2007, 02:29 AM
you need a bigger amp on your highs if you are clipping your speakers to death. What amp are you using to power them? Throwing 100 rms at a pair of kappas should have been ear piercing loud.

Biker
03-15-2007, 02:48 AM
you need a bigger amp on your highs if you are clipping your speakers to death. What amp are you using to power them? Throwing 100 rms at a pair of kappas should have been ear piercing loud.


The amp I am using is a 4 channel rated 4X250 at 2 Ohms

Is that the problem?

Thanks
Biker

XanderMoser
03-15-2007, 02:52 AM
The amp I am using is a 4 channel rated 4X250 at 2 Ohms

Is that the problem?

Thanks
Biker

Your speakers are 4 ohms, so that would end up being 4x125 watts...are you sure that is RMS, not peak? I don't know how you could stand it, but I suppose you could have turned it up enough to make the amp clip or distort the speakers, not sure which would have come first.

Let me ask you something. When in casual conversation, do you find yourself saying "What?" more than anything else?

Biker
03-15-2007, 02:55 AM
What?

jmanpc
03-15-2007, 02:55 AM
Horns will blow your face off.

bryce-man
03-15-2007, 03:03 AM
What?


hahahaha.. i get it .. cause he said what?
hahhahahahhaa.

lol at myslef

tunes
03-15-2007, 03:41 AM
A few 10" pro drivers like EVs or Beymas paired with compression horns would easily get you clean and accurate highs at cop calling levels. Deafening.

If you don't have space for a setup like that though I'd recommend you look into the Memphis M Class 8" coaxial/components. They get very, very loud for components but need a good amount of power to really sing. Say, two hundred watts per side.

krisfnbz
03-15-2007, 02:13 PM
Buy a pair of Cystal sscs6's for your front and power them with a good amp.

DaveDSMer
03-15-2007, 09:43 PM
what amp are you running though what model.. not just specs.

req
03-15-2007, 09:45 PM
yea dude. what amp are you running. there arent many 125x4 RMS amps out there that arent surf boards...

and that guy who recommended EV's 10" fullrange - pay no attention to that **** :rolleyes:

phyphoestilic
03-15-2007, 09:51 PM
U said it urself, u clipped the speakers to death. Even if u get speakers that can handle 200rms ur still gonna keep trying to push it louder and louder until u clip it to death.

mvw2
03-15-2007, 10:09 PM
Look for anything with good sensitivity, high power handling, and plenty of excursion. Your limits to get loud will either be excursion based(low frequency extention) and thermal(burning stuff).

Did you have a budget for this?

I'm with phyphoestilic, you do need to take care of your audio system and understand its capabilities. Know what your speakers can take, know what your amps can provide(cleanly), and learn to listen for signs of stress/distortion either induced by overexcursion or by clipping of the amp. For clipping, just don't be a nut with the gains. Know what voltage is going in from the RCAs and know what voltage is going out to your speakers. The gains are there to calibrate your amp to your HU. It's not a volume knob. For excursion issues, just keep the woofers crossed a little higher. You're not going to get an authoritative 60Hz tone out of a 6.5" woofer. It just won't happen unless you're running a mini-subwoofer.

I will state this simply, an intellegent person could never damage their audio system in any way. They either set up their system so it was impossible to damage(gains set appropriately, x-overs set appropriately), or they at least listen to signs of stress and back off so they don't simply end up with $200 paper weights. If you know your hardware isn't up to your desired task, you make appropriate changes to allow you to achieve the desired results.

jmoreno150
03-15-2007, 10:20 PM
beymas

Biker
03-15-2007, 10:31 PM
OK I want to thank every one for the help, I am starting over and want to get this all right this time. I have had several amps and several different speakers but this is the latest configuration and the speakers are bad.

Amp is rockford fosgate punch 8004
Front stage are diamond S600S 180Watts RMS
Rear stage diamond 5 1/4" with tweeter in the speakers rated at 90Watt RMS

From previous posts some of you may know that I was putting out about 3 VAC above the correct gain setting because my Kennwood HU with 5 V Pre Outs at max volume would not allow me to lower the output of the amp. In other words the Gains on all 4 channels were at the lowest setting so the only way to limit the signal to the speakers was to keep the HU at < 85 %. Not always possible with Ho's in my ride.

So with all that said I understand why my speakers are gone. I want to start over this time with the same amp and purchase new speakers and want the loudest sound I can get.

I purchased 10Db attenuators so that my gains can be set correctly.

My question is this. Being on some what of a budget say with around $250 to $300 for both front and back speakers. Without SQ being of the major factor what speakers set at the proper gain level would give my truck the loudest sound.

If the answer is the same speakers I already blew then I can live with that. But if there are other options then I would be interested in hearing from you.

For example. I can get C4 Audio components rated at 150 RMS under $100 shipped or Crystal S600S rated at 100RMS for $300. So whats up with that. Guide me in the right direction.

Thanks Biker

mvw2
03-15-2007, 11:20 PM
You might consider looking into Pioneer REVs. I was raised on Pioneer, and they do take a good beating. I still have a +8 year old set of 6x9s that have been used almost daily their entire life. It will be a completely different sound than your Infinity and Diamond sets though, a whole lot warmer, deeper sound, less detailed.

Maybe consider some Focal Access or perhaps Polykevlars if you can find them cheap enough. They would be a step up from your Infinity/Diamond sets but still offers the same kind of sound as well as high sensitivity.

If you don't mind something more affordable, you might look into Phoenix Gold's RSD series. I know their subs can have the tar beat out of them and take it all in stride. I'm not sure if the coaxial/component sets are build along a similar ideology.

JimJ
03-15-2007, 11:22 PM
Piezo drivers.

Seriously, get yourself some Selenium 1" compression horns, mate them to Tractrix horns and blast away. No SQ to speak of :)

mlstrass
03-15-2007, 11:27 PM
I wouldn't say you really want total SQ if you're pushing your stuff that hard and playing it that loud. More like SQL, which to me is very loud, but still quite good sounding and enjoyable to listen to.

With that said I'd say 4 Pioneer REV 6.5" coax's would play plenty loud and still sound clean/good at loud volumes.

I run a pair for rear fill and love them. Pushing around 75watts to em and they don't break up, have very good highs and plenty of midrange.

You can usually demo them at CC and find em online for around $75-80 a pair.

Biker
03-16-2007, 12:33 AM
I wouldn't say you really want total SQ if you're pushing your stuff that hard and playing it that loud. More like SQL, which to me is very loud, but still quite good sounding and enjoyable to listen to.

With that said I'd say 4 Pioneer REV 6.5" coax's would play plenty loud and still sound clean/good at loud volumes.

I run a pair for rear fill and love them. Pushing around 75watts to em and they don't break up, have very good highs and plenty of midrange.

You can usually demo them at CC and find em online for around $75-80 a pair.

Sorry for the Nubee stupid questions but I really want to understand this. So I have blown speakers (Diamond Audio Hex S600S) because I didnt think they were playing loud enough. The Diamonds are rated at 150+ Watts continious RMS and your suggesting Pioneer REV 6.5" coax's which are rated at either 60 or 80 Watts RMS depending on model will play as loud or louder?

If thats true then I need to understand this power VS Loud thing going on here.

Thanks Biker

T3mpest
03-16-2007, 02:25 AM
Sorry for the Nubee stupid questions but I really want to understand this. So I have blown speakers (Diamond Audio Hex S600S) because I didnt think they were playing loud enough. The Diamonds are rated at 150+ Watts continious RMS and your suggesting Pioneer REV 6.5" coax's which are rated at either 60 or 80 Watts RMS depending on model will play as loud or louder?

If thats true then I need to understand this power VS Loud thing going on here.

Thanks Biker

more power doesn't always mean loud, my horns on 30 watts would be far louder than most comp sets going at max RMS, even a set of z6's which can take 300 watts. Effeciency plays a role too.

theCybe
03-16-2007, 02:38 AM
How about: Work on the installation, I'm sure there's room for improvement.

XanderMoser
03-16-2007, 02:52 AM
Mount one on the steering wheel. See if that's loud enough for you.

pikers
03-18-2007, 02:41 AM
Any sugestions?

Buy a line driver and keep the gains down on the amps. Oh, and stop stying to go deef before your time.:eyebrow:

casper97ta
03-19-2007, 07:31 PM
i got a 97 dakota with tweets in the doors and on the dash. clarions for rear fill and some focal comp. in the doors. and its freakin loud and clear. music sounds good and the vocals sound crisp, clear, and loud as hell. the tweets are running off the deck and the focals off a lightning audio 300.2. i think im going back to mb quarts though. just for mids not tweets. i dont see how you cant get you truck loud enough. x2 on the line driver for a better signal. you dont need to run 10db attenuators if you have a good signal going to the amp.