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halfstepdown88
01-03-2007, 06:03 PM
I have a 2000 Toyota Tacoma 2-door with a cab. The sound system is just the factory stuff. I want to improve my sound so I'm looking to get new speakers (and a week ago I messed one of the speakers up just a tad turning it up too loud and really bassy stuff sounds bad out of it now).

I've heard that 5x7 is what I need, thats what i've been told in two stores and thats what audiovox.com says but infinitys website says that both my speakers are 6-1/2" with a depth of 2-3/4" here
http://www.mobiletoys.com/partners/infinity/v_details.asp?MAKE=48&MODEL=TACOMA&RECORD=6380&YEAR=2000

Crutchfield says 6-1/2 inch and crutchfield says I can fit a 6-3/4" in the rear speakers.

I am completely new to this stuff and don't really know what to look for that makes a speaker good.

here are some pictures of where my speakers are.

Speakers in the rear of my truck
https://www.t-mobilepictures.com/photos/photo13/ea/b9/7e1779bd8354.jpg?_rh=9pkedxir4bsfv9w1ooycknxpe

Pen to show size I guess
https://www.t-mobilepictures.com/photos/photo12/c4/57/d7a696fdff6a.jpg?_rh=kngfhrlpvyy1ou0hrj4qhb3g

Front Door speaker (how do you get to these?)
https://www.t-mobilepictures.com/photos/photo14/d6/e3/600243fda942.jpg?_rh=8rm5s5r0ox3uldftaaql1zlp7

https://www.t-mobilepictures.com/photos/photo18/08/67/a1bcdafca2d6.jpg?_rh=8qv75wfay1mawbe7yo6r178gt



Also my friend's car has to get totaled and he has two amps now and said if they are still fine he could probably sell me one and I'll know sometime in a week. This would improve the sound of my speakers right? And should I also get a new head unit too? Thanks guys

enzowho
01-03-2007, 09:03 PM
I see this is your first post, so welcome to the forum! I will see what I can do to help you out. I will list some common ways to get better sound. Also, a budget would be helpful to us.

(I) Speakers
Speakers are separated into two main categories coaxles and components. Coaxles have on-board crossovers (control the frequency that is sent to each driver) and are built as one piece (the midrange and tweeter cannot be separated). The benefits of coaxles are they are cheaper, easier to install, and are satisfied by head unit power. The problem with them is they sound quality/volume are compromised. Components have external crossovers and the midrange and tweeter are separated. They are more expensive, generally more difficult to install and must be powered by an external amplifier. They do sound better though.
6.5" speakers are the preferred size. They have better midbass (60-200 Hz) output then smaller speakers and have better sound then oval shapes IMHO.
A pair of coaxles should run you around $50-100. A pair of components should run you from about $100 up.

(II) Subwoofer
Another way to get better sound is to run a subwoofer. This covers frequency ranges your midrange speakers cannot play. It will help add fullness and volume to your music. Subwoofers must be powered by an external amplifier. Also, they need an enclosure to operate. A common 10 or 12" woofer will need somewhere between .5 cu ft and 2 cu ft to operate properly. While we are on enclosures, I will briefly mention them too. There are ported and sealed enclosures. Ported will be louder and if tuned around 30Hz will have excellent sound quality. Sealed boxes are more simple and require less air space. Both can be made by you for $30 or $40 and if built properly will dramatically improve your subs performance.
A normal subwoofer will cost your between $100-300.

(III) External amplifiers
Amplifiers will help your setups sound in all regards. As mentioned above a subwoofer will require an external amplifier. I would also amplify your midrange speakers are well.

(IV) Head Unit (H/U)
An aftermarket H/U will definitely be better then your stock Toyota cd player. My family owns 4 Toyotas and each of them came with a sub-par cd player. I would upgrade that for sure.

(V) Other
There are many other ways to get better sound. I will briefly touch on some of them here.
(i) Sound deadening. If you want more out of your system, sound deadening is a must. Check out Raammat or Second Skin before you go out and by the expensive Dynamat.
(ii) Active processing. Another way to get better sound out of your component set. This is a more advanced technique though.
(iii)Good installation. Yes, I saved this one for last because its the most important part of your sound system. Lots of money will buy you great equipment but won't buy you a great sound system. Spend lots of time reading about how to properly install and tune your stuff.

So where does that huge post leave you? If I were you I would add things in the following order
1: New head unit. I really do dislike Toyota cd players and would recommend a new one. Search the classifieds on the classifieds forum. H/U tend to sell for very cheap on here as compared to an audio store. I would spend about ~150 for a used one.
2: Component set for the front. There are many different sets out there. Go to a store and listen for yourself. Bring a notepad and record what ones your like and dislike. Don't purchase your speakers without listening to them first! I would spend ~200-300 new (although used isn't bad).
3: Component amplifier. I would choose something that provides around 100 watts RMS into 2 channels. ~100 used.
4: Subwoofer with amp. If your budget is small go for one or two 8" (or your Toyota is a single cab). ~100-200 (pair). Amplifier ~100 used.
5: Sound deadening. Purchase ~10-20 sq feet if you are on a budget or a whole roll if you aren't. Deaden the doors (there's a sticky about it)
6: Coaxles for the rear speakers. Run them off head unit power. I would much rather purchase a good set of components and leave the rear speakers stock over purchasing two okay speakers for the front and back.

Well...that turned out to be quite long. I hope it helps you out. I would do 1-4 of the above steps for sure (and 5 would good too).

halfstepdown88
01-03-2007, 10:27 PM
My head unit is this massive cd player and tape player i could take a picture of it if you want. So buying a head unit first would be more important than new speakers?

And why are front speakers better and for the component sets are they hard to install? I don't even know how to access the speakers in the door, should I pay for installation or do it myself? And I would need to purchase an amplifier for it too.

I guess i'll just start out here. Thanks that was a really helpful post.

BlackMaxima
01-03-2007, 10:32 PM
good info there enzowho

JAZN
01-03-2007, 10:41 PM
I drive the same car and the sizes crutchfield has are correct. However, on the front doors you should replace the plastic baffles with wood ones since they are stronger. Follow the tips in this guide http://www.caraudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=95925
http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/3533/379ec.jpg

To get to the front doors, first take off the window sills. Pop off the push-type retainer on the end nearest the door hinge.
Pull the bottom of the window sill horizontally toward you and then pull it upward.
Pop off the 2 caps on the underside of the armrest and unscrew the 2 screws deep inside.
Unscrew the screw in the door handle.
Push the handle toward the door hinge (horizontally with the door) to pop it out.
Pop off the panel with the door lock and window control buttons and detach all of the wires.
There are retainers near the edges of the backside of the doorpanel (that attach the doorpanel to the door), which you can either just pull off or you can buy the doorpanel removal tool.
Pull off the door panel and pull the door handle through the hole in the doorpanel.

I never liked rear speakers in this particular vehicle, but that's just me. The cabin was small enough that it didn't necessitate them.

halfstepdown88
01-03-2007, 10:50 PM
Whats your setup/\? and did you make that wood baffle yourself?

And so should replacing the rear speakers be the last thing on my mind?

JAZN
01-03-2007, 11:04 PM
My setup is far from stock speaker locations so I'm not too sure that would help you. There was a lot of fiberglass and custom fabrication involved http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=7942

The rear speaker thing is up to you, but that would probably be the last thing on my mind.

enzowho
01-03-2007, 11:08 PM
My head unit is this massive cd player and tape player i could take a picture of it if you want. So buying a head unit first would be more important than new speakers?
Yeah, I know what the cd player looks like. Both my parents Camery and Sienna cd players have horrible skipping issues. If yours doesn't have this problem then I would move it down the list. Also, just fyi, if you do replace the head unit you can purchase a piece to fill up the space created by the smaller head unit.


And why are front speakers better
There are two groups of people on this forum. Those who like rear fill (speakers behind the listener) and people who abhor it. They both have their reasons for or against it so I will let you read about that one on your own if you want more info. Here are some reasons for better front speakers:
(1) Most people have limited funds and its better to get 1 good set of speakers then two sets of crappy ones.
(2) Most people prefer the music coming from the front (much like you are at a concert) vs behind you.
(3) Sound bounces and reflects. If you run huge rear speakers and stock front speakers the sound that finally reaches your ears has reflected many times over. It will have cancellation (quiet frequencies or overly loud ones) and more distortion.
(4) Many more. Honestly, I wouldn't worry about your rear speakers at the moment. Keep the stock and run them off of head unit power.


and for the component sets are they hard to install?
They are harder to install because they normally have three parts: a crossover, a midrange driver and a tweeter (for instance here (http://geizhals.at/img/pix/184987.jpg)). That means you have to mount 3 pieces instead of 1 (standard coaxle here (http://image.shopzilla.com/resize?sq=160&uid=276883688)). Also, as drivers are physically separated it is more difficult to set up the sound stage (basically when you set down and close your eyes it sounds like the vocals are in the middle, the violin is off to the left, the bass guitar is on the right. Its kindof hard to explain here, but if you do some reading you should get the basic idea). With all that said, components are the way to go if you want better sound.


I don't even know how to access the speakers in the door, should I pay for installation or do it myself?
That depends on how much money you have and what type of person you are. A typical installation will be expensive (for me far too expensive). I prefer to read up then install it myself correctly and save myself a few bucks. Also, if you hate working on stuff then pay somebody to do it for you. There are quite a few resources available to you here on this forum though (stickies are there for a reason). You should be able to find examples on how to do basically anything.


And I would need to purchase an amplifier for it too.
It depends on what you are wanting out of your system. If you want something that will sound okay and have only 200 bucks then no. BUT...you will hear a huge difference when you amplify after market speakers.

Hope that helps out a little bit. If you have more questions keep asking...

halfstepdown88
01-04-2007, 12:23 AM
Whats a piece? haha and I don't have any skipping issues should I get speakers first then?

Yeah it bugs me when I'm in the backseat of my friends car and all the sound is just coming from behind me, so I'll replace the front speakers and not care about the rear for at least a while.

Is infinity good? I've heard its good, should I look around for a good deal for infinity component system? And do I need to make sure they have the right RMS or something so it will work with an amplifier? This stuff is very interesting but pretty hard to get the hang of when you are just starting out, thanks for all your help guys :D

EDIT: Oh yeah I don't think I'll be able to get a sub as if I got one wouldn't I have to sacrifice less people being able to fit in the back?

enzowho
01-04-2007, 01:00 AM
Whats a piece? haha and I don't have any skipping issues should I get speakers first then?
The "piece" is basically a plastic cover that covers up the hole in your dash. If you don't have any skipping issues then I would go with some speakers/amp now then upgrade later if you want.


Is infinity good? I've heard its good, should I look around for a good deal for infinity component system?
Infinity is good if you are buying their $100-150 stuff. Above that and you can get better for less. A brand you might want to check into is Rainbow. For the money they are hard to beat. Also, if you do a search for Rainbow you will stumble upon other good brands.


And do I need to make sure they have the right RMS or something so it will work with an amplifier?
Its not necessary to match the output/power handling of your amplifier and speakers when you are buying your equipment. It is important that you set your gains properly though. When you go to install read up on the sticky. It will help you from frying your speakers by sending them a clipped signal.


Oh yeah I don't think I'll be able to get a sub as if I got one wouldn't I have to sacrifice less people being able to fit in the back?
It might be possible to build a box that fits under your seat? Look into some AA Assassin 8". They are cheap and require very little airspace. Perhaps you can find an install/enclosure where somebody has done this before. I doubt its that uncommon.

dleccord
01-04-2007, 01:11 AM
man i got a 99 ext cab. i had to go with door pods because the stupid window component was in the way.

JAZN: got some final pics?

JAZN
01-04-2007, 01:13 AM
It might be possible to build a box that fits under your seat? Look into some AA Assassin 8". They are cheap and require very little airspace. Perhaps you can find an install/enclosure where somebody has done this before. I doubt its that uncommon.
Gonna have a hard time with under-seat enclosures without using fiberglass in a tacoma. Even then you're gonna need pretty shallow subs. I managed to fit ~.3 cube enclosures for 8"s in the holes where the rear speakers are but don't expect anything spectacular as far as output goes.

bimma85
01-04-2007, 01:16 AM
man i got a 99 ext cab. i had to go with door pods because the stupid window component was in the way.

JAZN: got some final pics?

here's a **** pic :yumyum:

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/9298/dscn11498op.jpg

JAZN
01-04-2007, 01:40 AM
man i got a 99 ext cab. i had to go with door pods because the stupid window component was in the way.

JAZN: got some final pics?

The last couple pix in that link I posted are basically the final product as far as the front stage goes. I don't have any other pix.
Here's the sub http://www.soundsolutionsaudio.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=7328&hl=

Scroder2
01-04-2007, 02:57 AM
Not sure if your looking for a sub later on, but I had a 2000 Tacoma with a 10in JLw3 in a stealthbox in the rear cab that sounded phenomenal. I had the amp under the passenger seat. They are a little pricey, but I see them every once in a while on Ebay---So if your ever looking for a sub---worth a look

Dave

halfstepdown88
01-04-2007, 10:28 AM
Are these good components

http://www.premier-audio.com/Rainbow-SLX-265-Deluxe-6-5-Components-p/rainbow%20slx%20265%20d.htm

http://www.premier-audio.com/Rainbow-CSX-265-6-5-Components-p/rainbow%20csx%20265.htm

http://www.premier-audio.com/Rainbow-SLC-265-6-5-Components-p/rainbow%20slc%20265.htm

And yeah I'm probably looking to get a sub later on

EDIT:Would it be a good idea to get a kick panel q-form enclosure

JAZN
01-04-2007, 12:55 PM
If you're going to get the q-form kick panels, then the largest speaker you can use is ~6 1/8" IIRC. I disliked the q-forms, but that doesn't mean you can't get good results out of them. You'll have to strengthen them too by using fiberglass and/or sound deadening to get good results because they are rather flimsy.

enzowho
01-04-2007, 07:32 PM
I disliked the q-forms, but that doesn't mean you can't get good results out of them. You'll have to strengthen them too by using fiberglass and/or sound deadening to get good results because they are rather flimsy.
Agreed. Don't be afraid to fiberglass either, there are lots of good tutorials here. I wouldn't start out trying to glass your own kick-panels, but reinforcing some q-forms wouldn't be too bad. Expect to spend 40-50 bucks if you already have a mask.

Also if you can afford them, I would go with the Kickpass components found here (http://www.premier-audio.com/Rainbow-SLC-265-Kick-6-5-Components-p/rainbow%20slc%20265%20kick.htm). I have never heard that tweeter before, but I know that 6.5" driver is good. The actual midrange is average for that price (good), but the midbass is awesome. You can feel it hit you in your chest. Also, there are a couple of Rainbow dealers on this forum who might be able to give you some better advice. I know 6spdcoupe deals with them, might want to drop him a pm.

Edit: Also PremierAudio deals with Rainbows I believe, could pm him too.

halfstepdown88
01-04-2007, 07:58 PM
Agreed. Don't be afraid to fiberglass either, there are lots of good tutorials here. I wouldn't start out trying to glass your own kick-panels, but reinforcing some q-forms wouldn't be too bad. Expect to spend 40-50 bucks if you already have a mask.

Also if you can afford them, I would go with the Kickpass components found here (http://www.premier-audio.com/Rainbow-SLC-265-Kick-6-5-Components-p/rainbow%20slc%20265%20kick.htm). I have never heard that tweeter before, but I know that 6.5" driver is good. The actual midrange is average for that price (good), but the midbass is awesome. You can feel it hit you in your chest. Also, there are a couple of Rainbow dealers on this forum who might be able to give you some better advice. I know 6spdcoupe deals with them, might want to drop him a pm.

Edit: Also PremierAudio deals with Rainbows I believe, could pm him too.


Wow those look good.

If I was to get those, put it in my front door speakers in the plastic baffle, would it sound good? Where would i put the tweeters and crossovers? would I have to do all this drillling and stuff? And would I need a new head?

EDIT: haha sorry for all these questions but on another site it says this

"System has to be used with an 80 Hz (12 dB/Oct.) high pass!
System needs approximately 10 hours running in time for optimal sound reproduction."

What exactly is going on there?

By the way I posted this in numerous forums and this one has helped the most by FAR thanks

enzowho
01-04-2007, 08:34 PM
JAZN would be the one to ask about placing the midrange drivers in your doors. I think he suggested building some wood ones for better strength. I know my friend '02 Tacoma has stock tweeters mounted in the door, might try putting them there. The crossovers can be placed anywhere (under a seat, under the dash, etc.)

You don't need a new head unit. I'm sure your stock one doesn't have RCA outs, so you need to purchase an amplifier with high-level inputs. That shouldn't be a big deal, just something to be aware of. If you do get a new head unit, then get something with at least 2 pairs of RCA outs (non-fader and fronts).

All the Kickbass drivers must be high passed at 80Hz. This prevents the speaker from bottoming out (bad thing) on low frequencies. That is easily accomplished by setting your amplifier to high pass then adjusting the frequency to ~80 Hz. Just fyi, all midrange drivers need to be crossed over around 60-80 Hz, its not just these drivers.

As for the 10 hours break in period. That just means the speaker's sound/output might change in the first hours of operation.

dleccord
01-05-2007, 03:08 AM
i didnt use MDF for baffles but usps boxes. pretty stiff if you ask.

bwell
01-06-2007, 06:29 PM
My head unit is this massive cd player and tape player i could take a picture of it if you want. So buying a head unit first would be more important than new speakers?

And why are front speakers better and for the component sets are they hard to install? I don't even know how to access the speakers in the door, should I pay for installation or do it myself? And I would need to purchase an amplifier for it too.

I guess i'll just start out here. Thanks that was a really helpful post.

Just google search how to take your door panel off its a little troubling if you havent done it before.

I was in the same boat as you during july and I just starting looking and reading and got a start in the car audio world and what i have in my sig is what im running.

decent coaxials got for 150 for 2 pairs of speakers saved 50 bucks on crutchfield during a deal. I also got a custom fit box for my ranger (sealed) since i have a single cab and I didnt have the patience to make my own box but Im happy with my starter system.

halfstepdown88
01-07-2007, 06:19 PM
Ok everyone is telling me its best to get a new head first.

My friend told me MP3 playback is awesome.

I guess I would want MP3 playback, iPod compatible, and excellent sound and be able to adjust bass levels and all that.


Any recommendations?

EDIT: My friend may be able to sell me his old head. The rainbow slc 265 kick component system, I listen to stuff like pantera, metallica, pink floyd, and occasionally some stuff with a lot of bass. That will be good right? And will the mounting depth even fit? It says 65/63 mm mounting depth, infinitysystems says its 2 3/4" depth

enzowho
01-08-2007, 06:02 PM
My friend may be able to sell me his old head. The rainbow slc 265 kick component system, I listen to stuff like pantera, metallica, pink floyd, and occasionally some stuff with a lot of bass. That will be good right? And will the mounting depth even fit? It says 65/63 mm mounting depth, infinitysystems says its 2 3/4" depth

I know very little about h/u. Might want to try the head unit forum if you haven't already, sorry. The slc 265 should be pretty good for that genre of music. It won't do sub-bass very well, but that's not what its designed for. 65 mm is about 2.5 inches, so according to infinitysystems you should be fine. If they are too deep, build a Baltic birch plywood/mdf (if its going to get wet don't do mdf) spacer as shown in the previous pics.

halfstepdown88
01-29-2007, 05:50 PM
I'm thinking i might want to get this
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-lRkAEgjqltR/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=286350&tab=essential_info&i=130DEHP780#Tab

This
http://www.premier-audio.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=Rainbow%20SLC%20265 %20Kick&click=35

And to power the speakers and tweeters in the front this amplifier
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-TtSV94k0Xz8/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=120&I=489AP600

Does that look good? I guess after a while of that i could get like a 10" sub but that would do for a while.

enzowho
01-29-2007, 10:18 PM
Links don't work for me

halfstepdown88
01-29-2007, 10:28 PM
Oh sorry.
Pioneer DEH-P7800MP
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-2yWi2YYMQcr/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=286350&tab=other_items&i=130DEHP780#Tab


Rainbow SLC 265 Kick
http://www.premier-audio.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=Rainbow%20SLC%20265 %20Kick&click=35


Amplifier for the Rainbow SLC kick
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-TtSV94k0Xz8/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=120&I=489AP600