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JimJ
09-26-2006, 10:37 PM
This is turning out to be a real PITA...probably won't get a lot of help here, but w/e.

Because I'm sitting so close to pretty high efficiency speakers, any sort of noise or sonic grunge is going to find its way into the final sound...and my Rogue Audio 66 does impart a little bit of "grunge" in the form of a hiss. Cleaned the tube pins, lifted the grounds, still does it - it's definitely not a grounding issue. So I'm looking for a preamp that, well, doesn't do anything to the sound :uhoh:

I figured EhRon can help with this a little, I'm sort of thinking about a Rotel RC-1070...my requirements for a preamp is that it be:

- quiet, don't want to hear any increase in the noise floor
- remote volume
- balance control a must, not dual stepped attenuators
- under $800

Any suggestions? The Parasound P3 looks a little...tacky to me. Rotel gear looks much cleaner :p:

ballstothewall
09-26-2006, 10:47 PM
You need to give me your Rogue, then figure everything else out. :)

squeak9798
09-26-2006, 10:51 PM
I couldn't help you any as I don't pay any attention to home audio equipment.


Though I will say that that's one of the disadvantages to high efficiency drivers. Little imperfections are extremely audible.

:crap:

**** us and our love of high efficiency drivers.

Good luck in your search.

Other than that, I'm useless.

JimJ
09-26-2006, 10:54 PM
You need to give me your Rogue, then figure everything else out. :)

It's yours for free, plus a $700 handling charge :up2somet:

joetama
09-26-2006, 11:08 PM
Hmmm bad *** two channel solid state pre-amp under $800.... Give me a little bit to do some looking/thinking/reading... Off the top of my head, I would say the Rotel would be pretty good. However, the hiss might just be amp gain... Unless it's really bad then it could be something else. Are you using valve amps too? Or just pre?

Crazy kids and their tubes..... LOL

JimJ
09-26-2006, 11:16 PM
Are you using valve amps too?

SV811's running single ended (my avatar image :)). They have a little residual hum just as part of their design, but it's almost inaudible. I can actually hear the hiss starting as the Rogue warms up.

ballstothewall
09-26-2006, 11:35 PM
It's yours for free, plus a $700 handling charge :up2somet:


Naaa, I'm upgrading to QSC amps for that price otherwise I would think about it.

joetama
09-26-2006, 11:46 PM
That thing runs 12AU7's right? What flavor are they and how old?

Anyway, check some of these links out....

Heard the B&K sounds GOOD, but never heard that model of Outlaw but have heard others.

http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/970.html
http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/rr2150.html
http://www.rotel.com/products/specs/rc1070.htm
http://www.bkcomp.com/preamp_tuner_wesay.asp

JimJ
09-27-2006, 12:10 AM
That thing runs 12AU7's right? What flavor are they and how old?

Right now, just new production Electro Harmonix's. I had NOS Mazda's in there, but the pins were discolored and dirty. I have a set of British-made Mullards from the '60s, NOS, but I don't want to put hours on a $100 set of tubes if I'm really not going to be happy :)

joetama
09-27-2006, 12:20 AM
Right now, just new production Electro Harmonix's. I had NOS Mazda's in there, but the pins were discolored and dirty. I have a set of British-made Mullards from the '60s, NOS, but I don't want to put hours on a $100 set of tubes if I'm really not going to be happy :)

True that man.... I feel your pain...

JimJ
09-27-2006, 12:42 AM
The Outlaw and B&K look really promising...will be doing more research on this in the next month or so, need to get a working analog source first :D

thylantyr
09-27-2006, 01:21 AM
Reduce your Rogue gain. {made a funny there -> Rogaine as in hair growth liquid}

Got a 66 schematic?

JimJ
09-27-2006, 01:56 AM
Nope, don't have a schematic :(

thylantyr
09-27-2006, 01:41 PM
Nope, don't have a schematic :(

Call them up and ask them that you want to reduce the gain,
see what their reaction is on how to do the mod.

kngadrok
09-27-2006, 01:48 PM
Right now, just new production Electro Harmonix's. I had NOS Mazda's in there, but the pins were discolored and dirty. I have a set of British-made Mullards from the '60s, NOS, but I don't want to put hours on a $100 set of tubes if I'm really not going to be happy :) :crazy:

Beat_Dominator
09-27-2006, 01:50 PM
Oh I see how it is :furious:


I have some ideas for you. Since looks are important, do you prefer silver or black? I assume black as your amps are that color.....

JimJ
09-27-2006, 02:00 PM
:crazy:

The guy I bought the preamp included them...I wasn't complaining :) I sure wouldn't have bought them on my own...I mean, Mullards are good, but not quite worth that much...


Oh I see how it is :furious:

I have some ideas for you. Since looks are important, do you prefer silver or black? I assume black as your amps are that color.....

Either silver or black would be fine, they'd both look good.

Beat_Dominator
09-27-2006, 02:01 PM
Are you trying to stay away from tubes this time around?

JimJ
09-27-2006, 02:06 PM
I think so...like I said on SSA, since the analog front-end is going to be tubed anyway, the preamp isn't doing anything but source selection and making sure the input impedance to the amps stays nice. So I doubt going SS there is going to make a ton of difference in the final sound.

Beat_Dominator
09-27-2006, 02:07 PM
http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatran&1164383865

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatran&1164510244

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatran&1163833456

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatran&1163122026

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatran&1162834844

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?preatran&1161958281

All pretty good gear.

kngadrok
09-27-2006, 02:13 PM
The guy I bought the preamp included them...I wasn't complaining :) I sure wouldn't have bought them on my own...I mean, Mullards are good, but not quite worth that.


No, I meant that reading that & trying to understand it ( way over my head), was making me crazy. Not you in general---------but you might be:laugh:

JimJ
09-27-2006, 02:30 PM
but you might be

Probably am :crazy:

Beat_Dominator
09-27-2006, 03:11 PM
Actually Jim, the ones I linked there ****....... :up2somet:

Beat_Dominator
09-27-2006, 04:47 PM
:furious: Jim you freakin' jerk! I just bought a new Pre! You ruined my life! :bawling:


Anyone want a Parasound P3? $475 shipped! :p:

JimJ
10-18-2006, 06:33 PM
Anyone else have advice?

I'm on the verge of buying that B&K Ref 5...but still could use some more insight.

Beat_Dominator
10-18-2006, 06:36 PM
Insight: buy my para :fyi:

JimJ
10-18-2006, 06:37 PM
But it's uglee :fyi:

Beat_Dominator
10-18-2006, 07:12 PM
It's not ugly at all really, ask Mike1 what he thought of it. He can give you an unbiased opinion.

joetama
10-18-2006, 10:48 PM
It is ugly.....

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 01:00 AM
...says the guy with the AV controller from star trek.

joetama
10-19-2006, 01:03 AM
Hey man mine is the exception! ;) So is the Classe.... Plus I'm just giving you a hard time I don't think it's that UGLY!!!

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 01:05 AM
http://bilder.minhembio.com/bild/index.php?pic_id=82942.jpg

It looks pretty normal to me :crap:


My Classe pre is plain jane lookin' but I don't care how she looks ;)

joetama
10-19-2006, 02:04 AM
I want a Classe SSP-600....

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 01:07 PM
I want SimAudio Omicron mono's but I don't whine about it like you!!!!

thylantyr
10-19-2006, 01:32 PM
I'm not really sure of your install and your needs, but if I were to buy a preamp,
I would seek a higher voltage preout design with balanced outputs, and
obvisously, low noise.... but is your amp able to cope with the higher voltage
preouts?

That's why I don't admire home audio amps very much in the sense
that they don't have gain controls and lack signal processing, features you can
use to optimize performance. If you really think about it, home audio has
been stuck in the dark ages vs. car and pro audio. People use high voltage
preouts in car and pro audio, but not common in home audio. People adjust
amp gain for best noise performance, but not in home audio. People take
advantage of signal processing more in car and pro audio, less in home audio.
The list goes on and on. What about balanced preamp signals? This is standard
in proaudio {you don't pay extra for it}, but in car and home audio it's a premium
item... All these things they do in proaudio and don't charge extra, are big
$$$ items elsewhere in spite that it's so easy and cheap to implement.

Too much audio comedy everywhere. If you wanted just a preamp, a signal booster
with volume knob, a simple DIY project can be made. You can make it balanced
with high voltage output with very little thinking about it.

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 01:41 PM
12v preouts are low?

thylantyr
10-19-2006, 04:24 PM
Home audio preouts are 1v typical.

Here's a typical piece of gear.
http://www.rotel.com/products/specs/rc1070.htm

1V preout, 100 ohms.

Something not typical.
http://www.parasound.com/halo/p3.php

1. Balanced XLR and unbalanced RCA outputs
2. Maximum Output : > 8 V before clipping

Given the two choices, the winner is easily seen.

joetama
10-19-2006, 05:11 PM
I want SimAudio Omicron mono's but I don't whine about it like you!!!!

You sound like my ex... So I'll tell you the same thing I told her... I DON'T WHINE ABOUT IT!!!

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 05:35 PM
Home audio preouts are 1v typical.

Here's a typical piece of gear.
http://www.rotel.com/products/specs/rc1070.htm

1V preout, 100 ohms.

Something not typical.
http://www.parasound.com/halo/p3.php

1. Balanced XLR and unbalanced RCA outputs
2. Maximum Output : > 8 V before clipping

Given the two choices, the winner is easily seen.

That's because Rotel is for n00bs. :fyi:

joetama
10-19-2006, 06:44 PM
Home audio preouts are 1v typical.

Here's a typical piece of gear.
http://www.rotel.com/products/specs/rc1070.htm

1V preout, 100 ohms.

Something not typical.
http://www.parasound.com/halo/p3.php

1. Balanced XLR and unbalanced RCA outputs
2. Maximum Output : > 8 V before clipping

Given the two choices, the winner is easily seen.

It's a different gain structure... Simple... You DON'T NEED HIGH VOLTAGE PRE-OUTS!!! That is a car audio/pro-audio myth... What is so hard to understand about Low-Drive = Efficiency = Clarity!!! Less voltage = less distortion, less voltage = less crosstalk, smaller components = faster components, faster components = more accurate ones. Pro-audio uses XLR and Higher Voltages for a simple reason distance. In a home audio setup most of your cables are going to be 3-4 feet max vs. a 50ft XLR cable which is sending ultra low voltage microphone signals. Also, the use of the XLR and higher voltage eliminates the antenna effect any long cable creates. If you are seriously running more than 1Volt in your home audio setup you have got a problem somewhere. I always learned from just about every person who has had any success in building PA systems signal flow is one of the most important things. So, that also flows into home audio, reason home audio amps donít have knobs. Yes given a lot of high end gear has higher voltage pre-outs, any one guess why???? ANYONE??? ANYONE??? Some higher end low gain amps need that extra boost on the input. BUT, I can promise that you don't need it. And remember this, if you input is 750 mV and you will reach your maximum gain on the pre-amp before you will reach 4 or 8 volts. Beat, do you run you stuff at 0 db??? Or wide open???? I hope not. By the way, specs donít always mean itís the holy grail either. ;)




That's because Rotel is for n00bs. :fyi:

Rotel is for n00bs??? Rotel IS NOT for n00bs!!! I'll put any Rotel equipment up against just about anything else. Why don't you pull you head out of your ***? I maybe conceded and a jerk sometimes but people who listen to my stuff don't disagree with me after they listen. I've only been doing this **** my ENTIRE life. I think I might know a little about what Iím talking about. Bigger is usually never the answer...

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 06:49 PM
Rotel is still for n00bs :fyi:

joetama
10-19-2006, 06:51 PM
Rotel is still for n00bs :fyi:

That just proves your ignorance.... Explain to my why Rotel is for n00bs?

joetama
10-19-2006, 06:52 PM
Wait... So is Arcam and B&W for n00bs too? How about Meyer, Yamaha, Ashly, and Midas? Why not insult my mother why you are at it...

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 06:54 PM
Your mother is for n00bs too :fyi:

joetama
10-19-2006, 07:00 PM
Your mother is for n00bs too :fyi:

Good one....

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 07:11 PM
I wub j00 B&W_EE :inlove:

thylantyr
10-19-2006, 07:41 PM
It's a different gain structure... Simple... You DON'T NEED HIGH VOLTAGE PRE-OUTS!!!

Correct, you don't need unless you have a problem that needs solving.
I can argue both sides of this argument. The way I look at this is. If I was given
the choice to choose 1V unbalanced preouts vs. 8V balanced preouts and the
other variables remain the same including cost, then take the higher voltage
balanced design because you have insurance. You have to analyze all the gear
in the chain to make sure it supports it.

I use proamps in the home so it makes more sense to choose XLR balanced
high voltage preout preamps. Using low voltage and unbalanced is not optimal.
Like I said, I don't know what the OP has for his system, but I would look into
high voltage balanced preouts if his gear can support it.

What is so hard to understand about Low-Drive = Efficiency = Clarity!!!
Makes no sense, explain.

Less voltage = less distortion
That is a design issue. You can make a 300v preout with low distortion. Many
quality opamps can do high voltage preouts as a standard feature with inaudible
distortion. It's the design engineers who dummy down the circuit so it only offers
1V to maintain that ancient home audio standard. lol ... ie, IIRC, the ancient 5532
opamp can do 9v rms output, a $1 opamp. If I was building a custom preamp
and amplifier, there is no reason I'm dumb down that opamp to 1v, I'd take
full advantage of it's abilities.

less voltage = less crosstalk
This is a design issue. Crosstalk is determined by many variables. You can design
a low crosstalk circuit with high voltage.

smaller components = faster components, faster components = more accurate ones.

I don't understand what you are saying here, explain.

Pro-audio uses XLR and Higher Voltages for a simple reason distance.
There are too more variables as to why do they this.

There is more to gain with balanced, high voltage preouts than low voltage
unbalanced. It's basic electronics. This doesn't imply that unbalanced, low
voltage will have problems, but there is less change of gremlins
manifesting with the other. :)

FYI, I'm not picking on Rotel or Parasound, nor do I really pay attention to what you folks have
in possession. I just randomly chose those two products to illustrate my preference...
so.. don't take it personal... :)

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 07:46 PM
thylantyr is wrong :fyi:

JimJ
10-19-2006, 07:50 PM
I use proamps in the home so it makes more sense to choose XLR balanced
high voltage preout preamps. Using low voltage and unbalanced is not optimal.
Like I said, I don't know what the OP has for his system, but I would look into
high voltage balanced preouts if his gear can support it.

It doesn't :)

My stuff is based on designs that came about decades before stereo came into existence, you think I'm running balanced inputs? :D

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 08:46 PM
Jim, you are too hardc0re for me.

JimJ
10-19-2006, 08:59 PM
What's an opamp?

:D :laugh:

I think mine fell out somewhere...

;)

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 09:00 PM
Oh noes! you need dem! :eek:

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 09:02 PM
So Jim, you're sure this: http://bilder.minhembio.com/bild/index.php?pic_id=82942.jpg : is too ugly for you? I'm going to put it on the 'Bay tomorrow if you for sure have zero interest.

JimJ
10-19-2006, 09:08 PM
Yeah, go ahead and sell it...

ballstothewall
10-19-2006, 09:08 PM
*Psssst* donate it to me....


Ok, now what is the difference between balanced and unbalanced inputs, please explain it to me, I'm a little hazy on that issue.

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 09:24 PM
Will do Jim.

ballstothewall: balanced uses 3 conductors instead of 2. 2 pass the + signal but in opposite in phase to eachother, then the 3rd is the - . Balanced lines tend to be a bith higher in voltage as well.

ballstothewall
10-19-2006, 09:25 PM
The advantage of balanced is what, no crosstalk?

GordonW
10-19-2006, 09:33 PM
Balanced lines have the advantage of rejecting RF noise better than single-ended interconnects (ie, RCA). RF in the signal, CAN have the effect of making hiss/noise/grit/grain worse. Having the amp deal with abnormally high frequency content/RF might cause it to go unstable, in some cases... many amp designs are NOT meant for that kind of bandwidth!

Of course, RF-stoppers (ie, the ferrite beads that snap onto interconnects and power cables) can help in a case like this, with RCA interconnects. But, there's only so much you can do, when the cable itself WANTS to act like an antenna (unlike a balanced cable, where RF basically CANCELS ITSELF OUT, inherently)...

Regards,
Gordon.

joetama
10-19-2006, 09:38 PM
What's an opamp?

:D :laugh:

I think mine fell out somewhere...

;)

Oh nooooossssss.....


So Jim, you're sure this: http://bilder.minhembio.com/bild/index.php?pic_id=82942.jpg : is too ugly for you? I'm going to put it on the 'Bay tomorrow if you for sure have zero interest.

How much are you looking to pawn it off for?

And Thy, I'm busy right now, but as soon as I get unbusy I'll answer those questions for you ;)

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 10:41 PM
I offered $475 shipped to Jimbo but he no likes it :crap:

joetama
10-19-2006, 10:51 PM
What's the model and specs on it? Why are you selling it? And How Old is it?

I might pick it up because I need another pre-amp at home...

BTW, what's with the Anti-Fi in you sub thing there....

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 11:22 PM
It's a Parasound P3, they came out in '00 I believe. I am the second owner, dunno what model year mine is, they never returned my email about the serial # code.

Beat_Dominator
10-19-2006, 11:25 PM
Oh, selling it because I wanted 2 pairs of balanced outs.

*edit* Balanced In I mean oops.

thylantyr
10-19-2006, 11:38 PM
It doesn't :)

My stuff is based on designs that came about decades before stereo came into existence, you think I'm running balanced inputs? :D

I read the thread this time. lol

You have a tube front end and tube amp and arn't satisfied with the noise from
the tube preamp. You should look into my suggestion, reduce the gain... call
the company up? Fish for a schematic? You can probably reverse engineer
the wiring and draw up a schematic, it can't be that hard. How much stuff
is inside the rogue?

Right now the solution is to migrate from a tube preamp to solid state?
If so, does the tube amp support higher voltage preouts? or can you
adjust the gain on that tube amp, even if you need to mod it.

Basically, that's what I'm getting at. A high voltage SS preout and reduce gain
tube amp will offer less audible noise. The balanced issue is a secondary issue
not applicable to your situation.

I had a problem with a SS amp where it was too noisy for my taste. A simple
mosfet design that when you placed your ear inches away from the tweeter,
you can hear audible hiss. The root cause is the circuit design, the quick fix is
to reduce the amp gain and feed this amplifier a higher voltage 'clean' input
to compensate. All it took was a opamp preamp circuit on the front end, simple.
This cured the amplifier problems, you could place your ear right on the tweeter
and hear no hiss.

Beat_Dominator
10-20-2006, 02:42 PM
thylantyr: I am handy with a soldering iron.....but that all sounds like a pain in the *** :laugh:

joetama
10-20-2006, 03:45 PM
^^^^^

Haha... Agreed....

thylantyr
10-20-2006, 04:36 PM
Yoda: Help you I can. Yes, mmmm.

Yoda: You must unlearn what you have learned.

Yoda: No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try.

:p: :laugh:

thylantyr
10-20-2006, 07:37 PM
I know this is hard, but check out this schematic, a common SS amp.

http://www.leonaudio.gr/images/4x50sch1.JPG

Text book design, 3 stage.

R6 and R8 ratio determine gain.

If you look closely, R8 connects to the output which makes it the feedback
resistor for the input stage. You can raise R6 in resistance to lower gain
or reduce R8 or any combination of the two. Common sense rule says
that increase R6 is ideal because decreasing R8 can drive transistor Q2 with
more current.

In other words, changing one resistor in a preamp or power amp
can allow you to opimize your noise and get better results.

Amplifier Mod Made Simple[tm] By John Basedow :)
http://fitness-made-simple.com/?source=adwords

JimJ
10-22-2006, 02:07 PM
http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/rogueaudio_metis.htm

Thought this was interesting. A review of the Rogue Metis, a close relative of the Rogue Model 66, except with 6SN7 tubes...


When I hooked up the Metis to my Art Audio amp and ReTHM speakers, it was a bit noisy, producing easily heard hiss and low-level hum. The combination of a fairly sensitive amp input (0.7V) and very sensitive speakers (102dB) makes a very good noise detector. My standard noise remedy is to insert Rothwell inline attenuators between the preamp and amp, which reduces the signal to the amp by 10dB. The signal that is reduced contains the noise, so when the preamp volume control is turned to the desired setting, you’re getting more signal and less noise. The Metis has oodles of gain, so the Rothwell attenuators worked well. There was still a very slight buzzing from the Metis, audible only near the speakers. Yes, I tried floating the ground, but that just added some hum. Other preamps in my collection (deHavilland Mercury 2, Audio Note M2 Phono, and Audio Research SP9 Mk III -- all more expensive units) don’t exhibit a similar noise problem.

Describes my problem to a T.

Beat_Dominator
10-22-2006, 02:09 PM
My MLs have a sens. of 84dB.....on a good day ;)

thylantyr
10-22-2006, 03:34 PM
http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/rogueaudio_metis.htm

Thought this was interesting. A review of the Rogue Metis, a close relative of the Rogue Model 66, except with 6SN7 tubes...



Describes my problem to a T.

There's some comedy to this.

To explain.

An amplifier has gain, and it's fixed gain as shown on that schematic I linked
eariler.

But, amplifiers with gain knobs are not really gain adjustments, they are input attenuators to reduce the signal, gain remains fixed
in spite that the amplifier is labed as 'gain'. ... lol ... You probably know this already ...

By adding input attenuators you are essentially making a 'gain control' even
though it's not the real thing. This can help relieve the problem, but if you
want to solve the problem at the root level, you change the amplifier gain,
that feedback resistor I talked about. This method will give you the best
performance because a high gain amplifier with attenuated input is still
in 'high gain mode' which can amplify noise present, usually noise from the
amplifier itself can be annoying.

joetama
10-22-2006, 06:30 PM
My MLs have a sens. of 84dB.....on a good day ;)

What do they have on a bad day?? Does anyone actually read Thy's posts anymore?

Beat_Dominator
10-22-2006, 06:35 PM
I think a rating of like 82dB would be more realistic. Good thing I have plenty of headroom.

joetama
10-22-2006, 10:11 PM
Well 90 is better ;)....

JimJ
10-22-2006, 10:12 PM
Well 96 is...wait, that's the reason I'm having this **** problem in the first place.

:)

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 01:02 AM
Horns are the devil.... but this thread is about t00bs ;)

joetama
10-23-2006, 01:13 AM
Well 96 is...wait, that's the reason I'm having this **** problem in the first place.

:)

Yea... About that.....


Horns are the devil.... but this thread is about t00bs ;)

Horns aren't the devil, he HAS horns... Get it right.. LOL....

F(x)=x00bs
F(n)=n00bs
F(t)=t00bs

Theory?

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 01:15 AM
Buy my **** ;)

joetama
10-23-2006, 01:33 AM
Who you talking to? Me or Jim?

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 01:34 AM
Both of you :laugh:

joetama
10-23-2006, 01:48 AM
$25 was the price right ;)

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 01:49 AM
Almost!

joetama
10-23-2006, 01:53 AM
I'm curious about it but it's hard for me to buy something I have never heard first of all and second I don't like used equipment....

Nothing against you beat.... I just don't like anyone else to pop the equipment's cherry.... Maybe they can finger around it a little bit but I'm the one who wants to demolish it... If you know what I mean....

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 01:56 AM
Yer Dirrrty. :fyi:

thylantyr
10-23-2006, 01:57 AM
Does anyone actually read Thy's posts anymore?

Only the people interested in audio and electronics, lol ...

To answer the question, low % of people here, lol .....

I probably get more people reading my posts on CAF than here
in spite that CAF home audio generates less hits, lol ......

We have some killer threads in their archives....

I'm just here 'testing the waters' to see what people are interested in....

So, far... not enough evil audio people ........ time to recruit .......

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 01:59 AM
Don't worry, I read your boring posts thy....

thylantyr
10-23-2006, 02:01 AM
Don't worry, I read your boring posts thy....

There is light at the end of the evil tunnel.

joetama
10-23-2006, 02:10 AM
Yer Dirrrty. :fyi:

No Dirty is my hero.... LOL....

JimJ
10-23-2006, 11:32 AM
So, far... not enough evil audio people ........ time to recruit .......

This is the land of HTIB's and where "upgrading" your home audio setup consists of changing the subwoofer...and anything less than 5 channels is for old people.

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 12:59 PM
5? Try 8 you weirdo!

ballstothewall
10-23-2006, 01:59 PM
This is the land of HTIB's and where "upgrading" your home audio setup consists of changing the subwoofer...and anything less than 5 channels is for old people.


You lie.....:)



And I ready Thy's posts. :uhoh:

Beat_Dominator
10-23-2006, 02:01 PM
You're screwed if you read his posts...it's like the movie The Ring :fyi:

joetama
10-23-2006, 02:03 PM
Oh ****.... You watched the movie!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Beat_Dominator
10-24-2006, 01:11 AM
Indeed :uhoh: