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View Full Version : Importance of having Components in the front and rear???



jklfd
06-23-2006, 10:38 PM
How important are having components up front and in the back?

Is it ok to have components up front and coaxiles in the back?

Im mainly looking for sweet highs, and good midbass since I will have 2 12"s in the back to take care of the low freq. Any brand to recommend me look into?

Please help

neonrt
06-24-2006, 12:12 AM
from what i hear you should have comps in the front and coax's in the rear.

Worlddre
06-24-2006, 12:13 AM
who needs rears

Bolognablake
06-24-2006, 12:16 AM
<--- has no rear stage.

backtofront001
06-24-2006, 12:19 AM
When you go to a concert where does the sound come from -- The Front. Rear speakers just ruin your sound stage. Just get a good pair of components for the front, give it decent power and you will be set. Search for Rainbow's

937DYTBOI
06-24-2006, 12:19 AM
im see y people dont have rear stages now, the bass is to **** loud it cancels out the rear stage if ur stuff is really that loud

Prowler573
06-24-2006, 12:20 AM
who needs rears *raises hand*

I do.
Amplified rears even.
Amped components even.
Don't care what you bishes think even. :D
That is all even. :wave:

937DYTBOI
06-24-2006, 12:22 AM
*raises hand*

I do.
Amplified rears even.
Amped components even.
Don't care what you bishes think even. :D
That is all even. :wave:


Sweet im diggin the flow homie

Bolognablake
06-24-2006, 12:23 AM
*raises hand*

I do.
Amplified rears even.
Amped components even.
Don't care what you bishes think even. :D
That is all even. :wave:

It's ok. Nobody's perfect.

;)

Prowler573
06-24-2006, 12:25 AM
It's ok. Nobody's perfect.

;)

Never claimed perfection ever once, friend. ;)

I live very securely in the knowledge that I am the only person who absolutely has to think my setup sounds good.

ntense702
06-24-2006, 12:29 AM
Never claimed perfection ever once, friend. ;)

I live very securely in the knowledge that I am the only person who absolutely has to think my setup sounds good.
as long as you are happy with your setup, that is all that matters, I personally only run a front stage.

bamaboy
06-24-2006, 12:36 AM
i dont use rears either, who cares about rear passengers, if they are special they ride up front

i cant hear the back ones, so im not wasting my money

azbass
06-24-2006, 12:37 AM
what kinda sound set up do you want is the question, there is nothing wrong with having rear speakers.

Gary S
06-24-2006, 12:43 AM
http://www.caraudio.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1837291&postcount=12

6spdcoupe
06-24-2006, 12:44 AM
My rear passengers arent picky at all, so no need for fill...

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/12/web/252000-252999/252930_142_full.jpg

:D

Prowler573
06-24-2006, 12:45 AM
as long as you are happy with your setup, that is all that matters, I personally only run a front stage.
100% Correct. :thumbsup: I am well aware that my preference is atypical to the thoughts of "the right way to do things" held by most. I don't care to tell anyone that they are wrong for doing it the way they want to anymore than I care to hear someone else tell me my way is dumb. Until someone else starts buying the gear I use/install/enjoy I'll keep doing it how I want and allow everyone else to enjoy the right to do likewise. ;)



i dont use rears either, who cares about rear passengers, if they are special they ride up front

i cant hear the back ones, so im not wasting my moneyI very rarely have passengers at all front or rear. My use of rear fill has nothing to do with a better sonic environment for anyone other than myself. I like the way having amped speakers behind me sounds. As 99.8% of the time I am the only person in my car I'm the only one that has to. If it is so distasteful to anyone who may on the odd occasion catch a ride from me that they cannot stand to be inside the car with it they are more than welcome to get out. :)

I don't have a monstrous substage so it isn't a huge fight for the rear fill to be heard over it in my case.

2LouDFoRThiS
06-24-2006, 01:48 AM
rear fill is a luxury .. lol

James Bang
06-24-2006, 03:04 AM
100% Correct. :thumbsup: I am well aware that my preference is atypical to the thoughts of "the right way to do things" held by most. I don't care to tell anyone that they are wrong for doing it the way they want to anymore than I care to hear someone else tell me my way is dumb. Until someone else starts buying the gear I use/install/enjoy I'll keep doing it how I want and allow everyone else to enjoy the right to do likewise. ;)


I very rarely have passengers at all front or rear. My use of rear fill has nothing to do with a better sonic environment for anyone other than myself. I like the way having amped speakers behind me sounds. As 99.8% of the time I am the only person in my car I'm the only one that has to. If it is so distasteful to anyone who may on the odd occasion catch a ride from me that they cannot stand to be inside the car with it they are more than welcome to get out. :)

I don't have a monstrous substage so it isn't a huge fight for the rear fill to be heard over it in my case.
true true true and true. i feel the same way, but about a front stage only :p:

i love having only a front stage and everything time aligned to the driver seat. whatever floats your boat.

dleccord
06-24-2006, 03:57 AM
using rainbow comps for rearfill is a waste of money IMO

brypink
06-24-2006, 05:12 AM
I wonder if all the anti rear fill or rear speakers fanatics would have changed their mind if SACD's picked up in popularity and crossed over to car audio. Unfortunately, the SACD format is beginning to be a dead breed and doubt the popularity will ever catch on.

Just a thought. :eyebrow:

BTW, there's a lot of car audio that I think is a waste of money...but, I'll keep my comments to myself! :up2somet:

myvanpounds
06-24-2006, 07:12 AM
yo bry. I can't decide on my front stage. I'm gonna have to go three way too since the 18 rolls off at 50-60. so I dunno what exactly to get. there is a I'D three way with IDQ8's and 6.5's with the pizo mini horns but I'm not sure how well those wil work being a capcitive load. all I know is I have to be able to have a front stage that can get 50-20k flat at 110-120 dbs. oh ya you also talked me into the H701 only because it has time alighnment and the dqxs doesn't. can the H701 take a full range and split it 3-4 ways

Bolognablake
06-24-2006, 08:55 AM
I wonder if all the anti rear fill or rear speakers fanatics would have changed their mind if SACD's picked up in popularity and crossed over to car audio. Unfortunately, the SACD format is beginning to be a dead breed and doubt the popularity will ever catch on.

Just a thought. :eyebrow:

BTW, there's a lot of car audio that I think is a waste of money...but, I'll keep my comments to myself! :up2somet:

I would be willing to bet most of us don't have head units capable of playing SACDs. If my head unit had the ability, I'd be rocking a 5.1 system.

theothermike
06-24-2006, 03:15 PM
LOL 6spd, i can see u training ur kids at 6 to do sub recones and amp installations. LOL. What car audio pimps they will be. Back on topic. Right now i have rear fills for one reason bass. I have stock 6.5 comps and stock 6x9's off my alpine, i tuned the 6x9's to hit the bass frequencys because no sub. And i have my comps to hit the mids and highs. i will probably loose my 6x9's when my next setup comes around. Ill use the 6x9 holes as a vent for the sub into cabin. if i dont like all the massive bass, ill probably but another set of mid bass driver matching the comps in back with no tweeters. and ill have them running of hu power or a small 25-40 wat amp rms.
IMO as long as u have a sub, no need for rears. u need rears without a sub though to hit the lows


Mike

squeak9798
06-24-2006, 04:26 PM
My rear passengers arent picky at all, so no need for fill...

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/12/web/252000-252999/252930_142_full.jpg

:D

Just wait till they get old enough to enjoy "music"......you'll have rear fill in and an "I'm a Little Tea Pot" CD in the deck :D You'll forget what real music sounds like.......

PS: "The Wheels on the Bus" has some decent bass to it ;)

6spdcoupe
06-24-2006, 04:50 PM
LOL 6spd, i can see u training ur kids at 6 to do sub recones and amp installations. LOL. What car audio pimps they will be.


Mike


Absolutely !! :D

6spdcoupe
06-24-2006, 04:51 PM
Just wait till they get old enough to enjoy "music"......you'll have rear fill in and an "I'm a Little Tea Pot" CD in the deck :D You'll forget what real music sounds like.......

PS: "The Wheels on the Bus" has some decent bass to it ;)


Hey now I still have time..lemme enjoy it now. ;)

RumbleNTheTrunk
06-24-2006, 04:53 PM
rears are pretty useless for my reg. cab ford f-150

bri487
06-24-2006, 04:58 PM
i love my rear speakers, actually i love my time delay even more.

jklfd
06-24-2006, 10:05 PM
word for the help guys, So i decided to go with components in the front and just coaxile or just stock in the rear. Ive never heard of Rainbows before and please dont bash, Id admit, Im a noob when it comes to car audio. What good set of components will be mine for around 200$? Also, is wiring the components to be run off my HU fine? Or will i need an entire new amp just to run the components?

Prowler573
06-24-2006, 10:09 PM
word for the help guys, So i decided to go with components in the front and just coaxile or just stock in the rear. Ive never heard of Rainbows before and please dont bash, Id admit, Im a noob when it comes to car audio. What good set of components will be mine for around 200$? Also, is wiring the components to be run off my HU fine? Or will i need an entire new amp just to run the components?

Running components off of head unit power while technically possible it really shouldn't be done. You will never realize even half of the potential of a decent set of components off of the 20 watts or so of actual, usable power coming out of a head unit's internal amp. You really do need an outboard amp for component use :fyi:

helotaxi
06-25-2006, 09:52 AM
all I know is I have to be able to have a front stage that can get 50-20k flat at 110-120 dbs.
Looking for bleeding ears, eh? That kind of volume from the mids and highs is WAY too much. If you don't have hearing loss yet, you would after about 15-20 sec at that type of volume.

myvanpounds
06-25-2006, 10:08 AM
Looking for bleeding ears, eh? That kind of volume from the mids and highs is WAY too much. If you don't have hearing loss yet, you would after about 15-20 sec at that type of volume.

lol, I play drums and guitar... I'm used to 110 dbs

helotaxi
06-25-2006, 09:21 PM
At lower freqs maybe. Try listening to 110-120 dB in the 500-5k range. Without ear plugs you WILL have permanent damage to your hearing VERY quickly. Course you probably do already, but that's still no reason to ask for it to get worse.

BTW, you will probably have trouble getting that kind of output from a conventional set of car comps. You would need horns for that kind of output. Car Stereo review managed to get 120 out of a set of them in the mid 90's and were astounded by how much louder they were compared to everything else they have ever heard.

squeak9798
06-25-2006, 10:06 PM
At lower freqs maybe. Try listening to 110-120 dB in the 500-5k range. Without ear plugs you WILL have permanent damage to your hearing VERY quickly. Course you probably do already, but that's still no reason to ask for it to get worse.

:word:

120db of midrange is completely different than 120db of bass/midbass. 120db of midrange will permanently damage your hearing in a very short period of time.


BTW, you will probably have trouble getting that kind of output from a conventional set of car comps. You would need horns for that kind of output. Car Stereo review managed to get 120 out of a set of them in the mid 90's and were astounded by how much louder they were compared to everything else they have ever heard.

One of the mags measured my old Illusion Audio CH1 horns at 119db :D

myvanpounds
06-25-2006, 10:18 PM
At lower freqs maybe. Try listening to 110-120 dB in the 500-5k range. Without ear plugs you WILL have permanent damage to your hearing VERY quickly. Course you probably do already, but that's still no reason to ask for it to get worse.

BTW, you will probably have trouble getting that kind of output from a conventional set of car comps. You would need horns for that kind of output. Car Stereo review managed to get 120 out of a set of them in the mid 90's and were astounded by how much louder they were compared to everything else they have ever heard.

take 4 12" 100db 1w/1m speakers and pair it up with a 100w tube head. now stick that about three feet in front of you. trust me I know that 120Db's used to sound like in the 500-5000k range. this is why I need at leats 110 from my front stage

psych0ticnemes1
06-25-2006, 10:22 PM
When you go to a concert where does the sound come from -- The Front. Rear speakers just ruin your sound stage. Just get a good pair of components for the front, give it decent power and you will be set. Search for Rainbow's

uh... surround sound? i enjoy my rearfil ty very much... you may like hearing notes from one direction, but i enjoy feeling 'in the middle' of my music...

6spdcoupe
06-25-2006, 10:59 PM
uh... surround sound? i enjoy my rearfil ty very much... you may like hearing notes from one direction, but i enjoy feeling 'in the middle' of my music...


But surround sound is for Movies, not music. I think this question is directed towards daily driving music.

squeak9798
06-26-2006, 12:03 AM
uh... surround sound? i enjoy my rearfil ty very much... you may like hearing notes from one direction, but i enjoy feeling 'in the middle' of my music...

Except that the music you're listening to was not recorded in surround sound, it was recorded in stereo.

If you enjoy feeling in the middle of your music, do you hop onto the stage when you're at a concert?

Also, a properly setup stereo with only front speakers should still be able to produce the "large room" affect, such as large concert halls where you "hear" some of the sound reflecting from behind you. This shouldn't be absent in a properly setup 2-channel system.

6spdcoupe
06-26-2006, 12:03 AM
Except that the music you're listening to was not recorded in surround sound, it was recorded in stereo.


I beat you too it focker. :p:

squeak9798
06-26-2006, 12:06 AM
I beat you too it focker. :p:

No more squeakinators for j00 :mad:

6spdcoupe
06-26-2006, 12:28 AM
No more squeakinators for j00 :mad:


I take it back, you win !

:crap:

squeak9798
06-26-2006, 12:55 AM
I take it back, you win !

:crap:


That's right.

You my bisch.

:naughty:

6spdcoupe
06-26-2006, 12:58 AM
That's right.

You my bisch.

:naughty:
:wow:

heyman421
06-26-2006, 01:04 AM
i have rear components, but they're just alpine type-r's, and i personally hate the way they sound, because when i'm driving, the rear tweeter is closer to my ear than the front tweeter, so i fade 80-100% to the front unless someone is sitting in the back, which is never, because i spend all my spare time trying to get my system to godly perfection, and friends just slow me down :)

j/k i have SOME friends... they just only call ME when they need a favor....

FoxPro5
06-26-2006, 01:10 AM
My rear passengers arent picky at all, so no need for fill...

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/12/web/252000-252999/252930_142_full.jpg

:D

Sweet!! How come my momma always faced me to the front in my car seat? Those kids are way too cute not to look at them. Must be a safety thing.

To the original poster, I used to think my Infinity Kappas in the rear deck were kick ***...hell I even faded them to the rear off the HU :emb: Only time and experience will tell you what's right for you. But take it from us, don't spend an appreciable amount of coin on rear speakers unless you REALLY know what you are doing. I regularly get the sense that some imaging cues are coming from behind me if they are in the recording...and I'm rear fill free and proud of it.

HitManSE
06-26-2006, 01:31 AM
Sweet!! How come my momma always faced me to the front in my car seat? Those kids are way too cute not to look at them. Must be a safety thing.


Definetly a saftey thing, incase of a frontal collosion the entire rear part of the baby's body will be pressed onto the entire seat spreading the load & causing considerably less injury to their body compared to a front facing when the weight is spread across the belt which at that age, they are very fragile & might not be able to take.
Id rather just face em backwards & be comfortable knowing they are safer :cool:

As for the rear fill, ive only had rear speakers in my car for the last year...yeah im serious lol never made time to get it taken car of. Broken crossovers FTL. Drove me nuts the 1st few months, but now ill most likley never want a rear stage again. Ive had enough of rear fill.

atwistd1
07-21-2006, 09:17 PM
But surround sound is for Movies, not music. I think this question is directed towards daily driving music.

just to interject my .02, ever been to a night club? dance floor is in the middle of the room, high's hung from the ceiling at each corner, mid range & mid bass usuallu on all 4 sides and subs in atleast 2 corners, all powered by atleast 50,000 watts of digital power. enough said. Sounds awesome and in the prime spot (middle of the floor) you become one with the music. I know this for a fact cause i run a night club and the people live for the sound, those that do not dance all try to stand on the edges of the dance floor to get the vibe from the music and sound. all sound comes from every angle! AWESOME!:up2somet:

helotaxi
07-21-2006, 11:24 PM
just to interject my .02, ever been to a night club? dance floor is in the middle of the room, high's hung from the ceiling at each corner, mid range & mid bass usuallu on all 4 sides and subs in atleast 2 corners, all powered by atleast 50,000 watts of digital power. enough said. Sounds awesome and in the prime spot (middle of the floor) you become one with the music. I know this for a fact cause i run a night club and the people live for the sound, those that do not dance all try to stand on the edges of the dance floor to get the vibe from the music and sound. all sound comes from every angle! AWESOME!:up2somet:
There's a difference between being surrounded by sound and "surround sound."

How's the imaging at the club? Oh that's right there isn't any. What about the staging? Oh yeah, still none.

The people that can't dance stand next to the dance floor so they can check out the chicks on the floor and so it's loud enough that they don't have to be able to carry on a conversation because they're to socially inept to do so. I fall into most of that so I know from where I speak. I did however learn to converse and realized early on that I couldn't dance nd quit going to clubs and began frequenting bars.

A night club need be nothing but LOUD. The quality of the sound is totally secondary to the volume. In fact I would say that it follows the old Soviet military matra of "Quantity has a quality all its own." Don't take that the wrong way. You pretty much have crap for source material anyway so it really makes sense to make it loud enough that you can't really tell. Besides who goes to the club to listen critically to music anyway. "Uhn tiss uhn tiss uhn tiss" isn't exactly audiophile grade material.:D

MAkahveli
07-22-2006, 03:35 AM
My speakers always sounded better from the rear than the fronts, when it was stock and till now with my combo of mb quarts and focals. My mercedes is a coupe so the rears are close enough to please me so I put my components in the rear and the tweets are almost aligned with my headrest

Eugenics
07-22-2006, 03:40 AM
it dosen't matter. if you put the time into it it will work. plenty of people with rear speaks have won sq comps, the same with people running no rear fill... its all about tuning, install, and how ***** whipped the judge is

BlackMaxima
07-22-2006, 03:54 AM
Having speakers in the front door is the front stage,
having speakers in the rear door, that not rear fill is it.
couse i still got speakers in the rear dash that im not going to replace , im not going to power these speakers at all .

Soo the rear door speakers are more in the middle of the car, soo its ok right, couse its not a rear fill???

atwistd1
07-22-2006, 06:38 AM
There's a difference between being surrounded by sound and "surround sound."

How's the imaging at the club? Oh that's right there isn't any. What about the staging? Oh yeah, still none.

The people that can't dance stand next to the dance floor so they can check out the chicks on the floor and so it's loud enough that they don't have to be able to carry on a conversation because they're to socially inept to do so. I fall into most of that so I know from where I speak. I did however learn to converse and realized early on that I couldn't dance nd quit going to clubs and began frequenting bars.

A night club need be nothing but LOUD. The quality of the sound is totally secondary to the volume. In fact I would say that it follows the old Soviet military matra of "Quantity has a quality all its own." Don't take that the wrong way. You pretty much have crap for source material anyway so it really makes sense to make it loud enough that you can't really tell. Besides who goes to the club to listen critically to music anyway. "Uhn tiss uhn tiss uhn tiss" isn't exactly audiophile grade material.:D

Dude, i do not know what the clubs in vegas are like, but here in NYC we only use state of the art equipmrnt as for imaging and sound quality goes, every live performer taps into our system to suppliment theirs. I think that when spending over 50K for a sound system and bringing in the best sound experts in the business to design it so that there is proper imaging and quality makes a difference, by your own admission, you stopped going to clubs and began frequenting bar's, obviously the industry has changed and you are not aware. We take our sound very seriously and as a result have one of the best systems in the business. as far as source material we are 100% digital and top of the line digital, our booth alone cost over 10k just for source equip. that is probably 50 times more than anyone would ever spend on a car audio system. Next time you are going to be in NYC contact me ahead of time and i will set you and your guests up with tickets and a VIP table, then tell me after a fair listen that it is a poor quality system based solely on loudness.

springy101
07-22-2006, 06:45 AM
6spd, your kids are lucky little bastards, why couldnt my dad be a rainbow dealer???

helotaxi
07-22-2006, 12:52 PM
Dude, i do not know what the clubs in vegas are like, but here in NYC we only use state of the art equipmrnt as for imaging and sound quality goes, every live performer taps into our system to suppliment theirs. I think that when spending over 50K for a sound system and bringing in the best sound experts in the business to design it so that there is proper imaging and quality makes a difference, by your own admission, you stopped going to clubs and began frequenting bar's, obviously the industry has changed and you are not aware. We take our sound very seriously and as a result have one of the best systems in the business. as far as source material we are 100% digital and top of the line digital, our booth alone cost over 10k just for source equip. that is probably 50 times more than anyone would ever spend on a car audio system. Next time you are going to be in NYC contact me ahead of time and i will set you and your guests up with tickets and a VIP table, then tell me after a fair listen that it is a poor quality system based solely on loudness.
What type of club is it? What type of live acts do you have? Depending on the act and the size of your place, it usually makes sense for them to patch into your setup for the simple reason that it is simple. Less stuff to move in and out and set up and less room taken up by redundant amps and stacks. You are still limited by how you have it set up. Highs in the corners and mids on the sides cannot create a proper stereo image. It can totally immerse the audience in sound which is sometimes the goal, but that does not mean the same thing as accurate staging and imaging. Basically your mids and highs are rotated in the room 45 degrees from each other. If you were to face so that the highs were arrayed one on your left and right in front of you and behind you (a normal front and rear stereo setup) you end up with mids directly to your front and rear and directly to your left and right. It is not possible to get a solid front stage wih proper left-to-right imaging with that setup. In a dance club it doesn't make sense to set up for proper staging and imaging as there is no defined front. It makes perfect sense to totally envelop the crowd in sound.

I think you are misconstruing my comments to imply that I think your sound system in your club doesn't sound good. Not the case. Having never heard it myself, I can' really make a comment. I'll take your word for it that it is extremely well done and that it sounds good. I can however say that it does not image and stage the same way that a nice home or car stereo will.

I have been to clubs all over the world, BTW. Tokyo, Moscow, Albuquerque, LA, Denver, Memphis and many other places. Many of the places I've been have hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in the sound system. They pride themselves, much as you do, in having a state of the art system. They do what they were intended to do, provide plenty of sound with enough detail that you can understand the words and still pound the chest with bass, extremely well, but they don't image at all.

A music club, one intended to provide a nice venue for live music, has a very different sound setup. There is a defined front and everything is keyed to stage front. A solid left and right front stage are established. If there are any speakers not in the front, they are barely amplified and are ususally a small two-way. Typically they are turned off during the live show and are only used to play the filler between sets. I love going to these clubs. Mostly because I love live music. These clubs and his type venue are the usual guage for a proper car or home stereo setup in reference to imaging and staging. With a system that images and stages properly, you should be able to close your eyes and place each instrument on the stage. The guitar is on the right, rythm is on the left, bass in the center and drummer in the left rear for example. This can all be done without rear speakers.

squeak9798
07-22-2006, 02:37 PM
Dude, i do not know what the clubs in vegas are like, but here in NYC we only use state of the art equipmrnt as for imaging and sound quality goes, every live performer taps into our system to suppliment theirs. I think that when spending over 50K for a sound system and bringing in the best sound experts in the business to design it so that there is proper imaging and quality makes a difference, by your own admission, you stopped going to clubs and began frequenting bar's, obviously the industry has changed and you are not aware. We take our sound very seriously and as a result have one of the best systems in the business. as far as source material we are 100% digital and top of the line digital, our booth alone cost over 10k just for source equip. that is probably 50 times more than anyone would ever spend on a car audio system. Next time you are going to be in NYC contact me ahead of time and i will set you and your guests up with tickets and a VIP table, then tell me after a fair listen that it is a poor quality system based solely on loudness.

Next time you have one of those high class acts in your club, have them stand on the stage and without the use of mics, speakers, guitar pickups or amplifiers, have them perform a brief song "unplugged". Then, plug everything in and give the lead singer a mic and let me know if the amplified performance possesses the same "staging and imaging" as the unamplified version. If it doesn't (and, given how you stated your sound system is setup, it will not), then you do not have proper imaging and soundstaging.

Also, when Helo said the source wasn't audiophile grade....I believe he was referring to the music and quality of that recorded music rather than to your setup. Dance club music isn't recorded on an "audiophile" grade, and typically does not possess the best sound quality to begin with.

headknocker
07-22-2006, 04:25 PM
Throw a pair of midbass drivers in the rear. You don't need tweets for rear fill.

Some of you guys are using a concert setting to make your point. You don't think you're getting sound bounced back at you from the rear of the pavillion? The highs are dulled substanially but the midbass is coming back at you.

squeak9798
07-22-2006, 04:30 PM
Some of you guys are using a concert setting to make your point. You don't think you're getting sound bounced back at you from the rear of the pavillion? The highs are dulled substanially but the midbass is coming back at you.

1) That's an affect of the enviornment, not of the peformance. If the concert is in an open area, then this would obviously not be a problem ;)

2) A properly setup stereo, with only front speakers, can produce this effect if the recording was a live recording that *should* include these effects.


The problem with rear speakers is that you are then receiving information from the rear when there should be none, not when it's a part of the enviornment as what might happen in a concert hall. Second problem is the increased number of point sources, which can reek havoc on phasing and frequency response.

snb778
07-22-2006, 04:57 PM
Dude, i do not know what the clubs in vegas are like, but here in NYC we only use state of the art equipmrnt as for imaging and sound quality goes, every live performer taps into our system to suppliment theirs. I think that when spending over 50K for a sound system and bringing in the best sound experts in the business to design it so that there is proper imaging and quality makes a difference, by your own admission, you stopped going to clubs and began frequenting bar's, obviously the industry has changed and you are not aware. We take our sound very seriously and as a result have one of the best systems in the business. as far as source material we are 100% digital and top of the line digital, our booth alone cost over 10k just for source equip. that is probably 50 times more than anyone would ever spend on a car audio system. Next time you are going to be in NYC contact me ahead of time and i will set you and your guests up with tickets and a VIP table, then tell me after a fair listen that it is a poor quality system based solely on loudness.


BOLDDDD statement. i know in my new system its gonna be around 2-3K for source units...probably closer to 3...and im sure there are plenty of people who outdue me. get 2 nice EQ's, 3*1000 dollar amps. a 1500 dollar Flip Screen...thats about 5K right there. that doesnt include any active Xovers that person is probably runnin, so add another grand

atwistd1
07-22-2006, 08:36 PM
What type of club is it? What type of live acts do you have? Depending on the act and the size of your place, it usually makes sense for them to patch into your setup for the simple reason that it is simple. Less stuff to move in and out and set up and less room taken up by redundant amps and stacks.

Marc Anthony with full orchestra, Jennifer Lopez, Ludicris, Victor Manuel with band, Judy Torres, Coro, Cynthia, TKA, Flogging Molly, Chili Pepers (several years ago) the list goes on. as you would know the latin acts involve alot of staging and imaging. at 100.00 or nore a person to get in you do not cut corners with an act and sound... artists are very picky. we hold over 3000 people in the main room i will try to attach a photo.

5355

atwistd1
07-22-2006, 08:48 PM
BOLDDDD statement. i know in my new system its gonna be around 2-3K for source units...probably closer to 3...and im sure there are plenty of people who outdue me. get 2 nice EQ's, 3*1000 dollar amps. a 1500 dollar Flip Screen...thats about 5K right there. that doesnt include any active Xovers that person is probably runnin, so add another grand

Each CD player costs over 3grand, we run 3, that does not include any of the amps (all crown's) any crossover / sound processors, mixers or the sound board (24 track board cost over 35K alone) this is not your neighborhood dive, this is a major concert/dance/performance venue in manhattan and holds over 3000 patrons on the main floor (stage and dance floor) not to mention another 18000 square feet of lounge space. We have 3 seprate sound systems (main room, lounge, VIP lounge) Club was remodeled 5 years ago at a cost of 6.5 MILLION dollars, sound systems are updated bi annually, there is a staff of 4 sound engineers that are constantly tweeking, replacing blown out mids, subs, adjusting, positioning, adding, enhancing.....

myvanpounds
07-24-2006, 04:11 PM
I wouldnt cal it a club more of a concert hall pwnd

atwistd1
07-24-2006, 07:52 PM
I wouldnt cal it a club more of a concert hall pwnd


Well it's a Dance club 3 nights aweek and concerts maybe 1 or 2 nites so i guess it serves as both. but my point is simply that some of the top sound system designers in the country and top sound engineers have designed, built and maintain this system and for the last 4 years the club has been billed as having the Best sound quality system in NYC, we feel that it is the best on the east coast based on evaluations given by some of the people that have worked it, from DJ's to concert sound engineers to the company who designed the system, and they have done systems all over the world.