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PESteele
05-30-2006, 05:41 PM
How much power are you giving them. Would 85 be enough

alphakenny1
05-30-2006, 05:57 PM
as i don't have them anymore but when i did have them i gave them 75 and 85 watts. man they pounded. the mids are awesome and 85 watts should be plenty to get those SLCs going.

PESteele
05-30-2006, 06:37 PM
ok great

Dunerider5
05-30-2006, 09:43 PM
120 isnt too much is it? I plan on getting some and giving them about 100-120.

Savstyle
05-30-2006, 09:46 PM
mine arent amped but stil get quite loud, But ive seen poeple give them aorudn 90-110 seems to be teh going amount

3.5Max6spd
05-30-2006, 10:06 PM
120 isnt too much is it? I plan on getting some and giving them about 100-120.

Thats fine:)

6spdcoupe
05-30-2006, 11:09 PM
120 isnt too much is it? I plan on getting some and giving them about 100-120.


Theyll take it and smile about it. ;)

carguy83
05-31-2006, 04:25 AM
sending mine at least 100 per side. my amp is a bit under rated. ;)

gl0ck
05-31-2006, 08:27 AM
sending mine at least 100 per side. my amp is a bit under rated. ;)

Same Here;)

konechiwa
05-31-2006, 07:46 PM
i have a question

Do the 'kicks' outperform the normal versions by a lot? On paper they seem to be better, but i don't want to go on that alone.

Thanks.

3.5Max6spd
05-31-2006, 07:51 PM
i have a question

Do the 'kicks' outperform the normal versions by a lot? On paper they seem to be better, but i don't want to go on that alone.

Thanks.

In midbass, yes. However I like that option best on the 3way set, as a dedicated midbass.

Theride
05-31-2006, 10:17 PM
im giving mine 60 per side but does not pound(midbass). I am assuming its because the baffle sisnt sturdy and solid. they get loud though

maxse
06-02-2006, 01:24 PM
Mine are getting 200 per side. This was suggested by the installer who had the same speakers running same power and loved it. NOw I do too they soun d incredible!

KaPPaBaLL
06-02-2006, 02:36 PM
Mine are getting 200 per side. This was suggested by the installer who had the same speakers running same power and loved it. NOw I do too they soun d incredible!
aren't these speakers rated at 150watt max?? wouldn't something go wrong if pushing too much power?

mach999
06-02-2006, 04:20 PM
aren't these speakers rated at 150watt max?? wouldn't something go wrong if pushing too much power?

It's all about the gain.

3.5Max6spd
06-02-2006, 05:12 PM
aren't these speakers rated at 150watt max?? wouldn't something go wrong if pushing too much power?

You'll never see full rated power from an amplifier with music, the signal dictates the power the speaker sees. However the bigger the amplifier's capability, it ensures effortless performance during dynamic peaks- so extra, clean power is always welcome. By clean, I mean power made easily before clipping.
That being said that rated 60 watts you feed your SLC's only comes at a clipped level(distortion) so you are actually seeing less. An increase in power will definitely show you performance gains in the most inefficient part of the set, the midbass.

They most def dont need alot of power to sing and sound good, but the midbass kick really comes alive with power to spare.

slick rick
06-02-2006, 05:25 PM
You'll never see full rated power from an amplifier with music, the signal dictates the power the speaker sees. However the bigger the amplifier's capability, it ensures effortless performance during dynamic peaks- so extra, clean power is always welcome. By clean, I mean power made easily before clipping.
That being said that rated 60 watts you feed your SLC's only comes at a clipped level(distortion) so you are actually seeing less. An increase in power will definitely show you performance gains in the most inefficient part of the set, the midbass.

They most def dont need alot of power to sing and sound good, but the midbass kick really comes alive with power to spare.

interesting...I have heard this but never put it to practical use. Manny I need a suggestion: my amp does 60x4 for my germs...I planned on using the DMM and getting voltage of 15.4v at like volume 45 (3/4). however, for the tweeters i planned on giving them around 40ish watts per the dmm method. Now I know a 1khz tone gain setting tutorial is supposed to be safe, but I planned on giving the mids the full rated power and the tweets less...this way high passed at 80 these babies can really sing. can the mids handle the full "15.4" gain setting that I do at volume 45 on music? or should I do what I originally planned on which was to set it at 15.4v at volume 45 and never play the radio higher than like 41-42. I mention this because between volume 42 and 45 there is a significant increase in voltage when I did some preliminary testing with the DMM sorry for the thread hijack. :)

konechiwa
06-02-2006, 05:35 PM
3.5spdmax, where would be that "power to spare"? 125? 100? 85?

3.5Max6spd
06-02-2006, 05:40 PM
interesting...I have heard this but never put it to practical use. Manny I need a suggestion: my amp does 60x4 for my germs...I planned on using the DMM and getting voltage of 15.4v at like volume 45 (3/4). however, for the tweeters i planned on giving them around 40ish watts per the dmm method. Now I know a 1khz tone gain setting tutorial is supposed to be safe, but I planned on giving the mids the full rated power and the tweets less...this way high passed at 80 these babies can really sing. can the mids handle the full "15.4" gain setting that I do at volume 45 on music? or should I do what I originally planned on which was to set it at 15.4v at volume 45 and never play the radio higher than like 41-42. I mention this because between volume 42 and 45 there is a significant increase in voltage when I did some preliminary testing with the DMM sorry for the thread hijack. :)

Quite honestly theres no reason to 'protect' those tweeters. I've fed the older, non-chambered Cal25's actively 100watt chs to themselves. I say hook it up and let it rip. If you go under Rainbow's website under the Germs and you look into each drivers technical datas you'll see it dont quite match up to the 'set's power requirements. The tweeter by itself has a 100 watt nominal/150 peak power rating;)
No minimum power requirement noted- typical of tweeters as they dont need much power.
The mid, however asks for 75rms minimum, 100rms nominal and 150 rms peak.
http://car.rainbow-audio.de/products/technical.php?lan=2&pro=1&lin=17
Obviously you dont have to go watt per watt as per requirement, but it gives you an idea looking at the raw driver specs whay you got to play with. So with that said, it should be no surprise if someone sent 200-300rms per side amp channels to the Germs and be in serious business:naughty:

Do you have a way to level match via the HU? That is more important IMO.

3.5Max6spd
06-02-2006, 05:42 PM
3.5spdmax, where would be that "power to spare"? 125? 100? 85?

I'd feel more comfy in the ~100 and over range- at that point its loud enough and strong enough to satisfy most for passive use.

If you notice under the specs for the woofer alone it states a minimum 50rms, 100rms nominal, 150 peak as well. These are quality speakers my friend, they can take power.:)
http://car.rainbow-audio.de/products/technical.php?lan=2&pro=1&lin=7

KaPPaBaLL
06-02-2006, 05:43 PM
You'll never see full rated power from an amplifier with music, the signal dictates the power the speaker sees. However the bigger the amplifier's capability, it ensures effortless performance during dynamic peaks- so extra, clean power is always welcome. By clean, I mean power made easily before clipping.
That being said that rated 60 watts you feed your SLC's only comes at a clipped level(distortion) so you are actually seeing less. An increase in power will definitely show you performance gains in the most inefficient part of the set, the midbass.

They most def dont need alot of power to sing and sound good, but the midbass kick really comes alive with power to spare.
I think I understand. I'm still new to the audio field. You're saying lets say for instance my speaker's (alpine type-r) is RMS is 55watts then it's ok to put the gain of my phoenix gold 800.4 amp all the way up? The amp is rated at 125watt @ 4ohm per channel so with the gain all the way up for one channel would be 125watts correct? Thus I'm pushing 125 watts(with gain all the way up) to a 55watt rms speaker is ok? thank you for the knowledge.

btw, i'm about to put passve crossovers rated at 300hz on the alpine type-r 6x9's is this recommended?

PESteele
06-02-2006, 05:48 PM
I think I understand. I'm still new to the audio field. You're saying lets say for instance my speaker's (alpine type-r) is RMS is 55watts then it's ok to put the gain of my phoenix gold 800.4 amp all the way up? The amp is rated at 125watt @ 4ohm per channel so with the gain all the way up for one channel would be 125watts correct? Thus I'm pushing 125 watts(with gain all the way up) to a 55watt rms speaker is ok? thank you for the knowledge.

btw, i'm about to put passve crossovers rated at 300hz on the alpine type-r 6x9's is this recommended?
no

6spdcoupe
06-02-2006, 05:53 PM
Guess you got all questions answered here already huh Manny. :)

Always one friggin step ahead of me. :p:

slick rick
06-02-2006, 06:00 PM
Quite honestly theres no reason to 'protect' those tweeters. I've fed the older, non-chambered Cal25's actively 100watt chs to themselves. I say hook it up and let it rip. If you go under Rainbow's website under the Germs and you look into each drivers technical datas you'll see it dont quite match up to the 'set's power requirements. The tweeter by itself has a 100 watt nominal/150 peak power rating;)
No minimum power requirement noted- typical of tweeters as they dont need much power.
The mid, however asks for 75rms minimum, 100rms nominal and 150 rms peak.
http://car.rainbow-audio.de/products/technical.php?lan=2&pro=1&lin=17
Obviously you dont have to go watt per watt as per requirement, but it gives you an idea looking at the raw driver specs whay you got to play with. So with that said, it should be no surprise if someone sent 200-300rms per side amp channels to the Germs and be in serious business:naughty:

Do you have a way to level match via the HU? That is more important IMO.

thanks Manny I guess I turned soft because I've had alot of noob user error setting up the set. I'm going to tune them via the dmm to full power and let them rip. :) I have been reading the Rainbow site and noticed the disparity between driver ratings. what do you mean by level matching? I have the pioneer 6600 TV setup which is basically the same as the 05 pioneer radio's tuning wise.

3.5Max6spd
06-02-2006, 06:11 PM
I think I understand. I'm still new to the audio field. You're saying lets say for instance my speaker's (alpine type-r) is RMS is 55watts then it's ok to put the gain of my phoenix gold 800.4 amp all the way up? The amp is rated at 125watt @ 4ohm per channel so with the gain all the way up for one channel would be 125watts correct? Thus I'm pushing 125 watts(with gain all the way up) to a 55watt rms speaker is ok? thank you for the knowledge.

btw, i'm about to put passve crossovers rated at 300hz on the alpine type-r 6x9's is this recommended?

The gain on your amplifier is not a volume control. Its to level match the amp with the output of your HU. Once you set the gains correctly, yes you should have a decent usable range on that power up to where your HU tops off voltagewise.

Even so, you need to understand the concept of music- its filtered by your xovers and delivered to your speakers in series of pulses- up and down signals ,rarely in a continuous manner such as playing a sine wave. If you can follow that concept , you can realize how people send an inconceivable amount excess power to their speakers systems with no problems, and enjoy the benefits of dynamic headroom.

By no means, does this mean you should overpower a speaker beyond its thermal limits. Become familiar with the speakers capabilities and use common sense.

I wouldnt put 300hz passive on 6x9's. The whole purpose of using 6x9's by those that do it for more sound and more midbass. Midbass freqs are roughly in say the ~80-220 hz range for example.

3.5Max6spd
06-02-2006, 06:18 PM
thanks Manny I guess I turned soft because I've had alot of noob user error setting up the set. I'm going to tune them via the dmm to full power and let them rip. :) I have been reading the Rainbow site and noticed the disparity between driver ratings. what do you mean by level matching? I have the pioneer 6600 TV setup which is basically the same as the 05 pioneer radio's tuning wise.

Are you going active or biamping? If you are biamping, the xover has some control of how the drivers are level matched as opposed to just the amps gains. At that point you can have a good old time with the phase relationship controls on that fancy xover:naughty:

slick rick
06-02-2006, 07:41 PM
Are you going active or biamping? If you are biamping, the xover has some control of how the drivers are level matched as opposed to just the amps gains. At that point you can have a good old time with the phase relationship controls on that fancy xover:naughty:
bi amping...each speaker gets its own channel. :) would you recommend leaving the crossover frequencies at 2200, or change them both to 2600? I know it is a matter of preference but to be honest I don't know what instruments would be afffected by this and how it would effect the overall sound. :)

3.5Max6spd
06-02-2006, 11:17 PM
bi amping...each speaker gets its own channel. :) would you recommend leaving the crossover frequencies at 2200, or change them both to 2600? I know it is a matter of preference but to be honest I don't know what instruments would be afffected by this and how it would effect the overall sound. :)

Unfortunatly, the only answer is to try yourself and listen for it. With drivers off axis, in our cars in factory location (mid in doors, tweets in apillars) I've found I rather have freq underlap between midrange and tweets-it makes for smoother transition and takes some midrange peakiness out- most cars boost the 1k-4k area dramatically and results in harshness. So I woud likely set the mid at 2200 and tweet on the 2600 side. But its trial an error, at least you have those options without going active.

slick rick
06-02-2006, 11:20 PM
Unfortunatly, the only answer is to try yourself and listen for it. With drivers off axis, in our cars in factory location (mid in doors, tweets in apillars) I've found I rather have freq underlap between midrange and tweets-it makes for smoother transition and takes some midrange peakiness out- most cars boost the 1k-4k area dramatically and results in harshness. So I woud likely set the mid at 2200 and tweet on the 2600 side. But its trial an error, at least you have those options without going active.

that was exactly what I was going to try..you also have a pm sir. :)

KaPPaBaLL
06-02-2006, 11:46 PM
The gain on your amplifier is not a volume control. Its to level match the amp with the output of your HU. Once you set the gains correctly, yes you should have a decent usable range on that power up to where your HU tops off voltagewise.

Even so, you need to understand the concept of music- its filtered by your xovers and delivered to your speakers in series of pulses- up and down signals ,rarely in a continuous manner such as playing a sine wave. If you can follow that concept , you can realize how people send an inconceivable amount excess power to their speakers systems with no problems, and enjoy the benefits of dynamic headroom.

By no means, does this mean you should overpower a speaker beyond its thermal limits. Become familiar with the speakers capabilities and use common sense.

I wouldnt put 300hz passive on 6x9's. The whole purpose of using 6x9's by those that do it for more sound and more midbass. Midbass freqs are roughly in say the ~80-220 hz range for example.
ok i got it. time to play around with it.