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View Full Version : Should I bi amp my Q's or not??



Boosted Josh
03-29-2006, 12:05 PM
I've got a question that maybe some of you experts can help me with.

I've got a 2005 mitsubishi evo that I'm putting a system together for. I'm having installed this weekend a set of MB Quart qsd216's for the front stage, and a set of rsc213's for the rear, and a 10w7 in a ported box. I'm using a JL 450/4, and a 500/1.

Ok now here is the question, would I be better off leaving out the rsc's in the rear and bi amping the fronts?

Or

Running both sets and using the crossovers that came with the speakers

Or

Bi amping the fronts and leave the stock "infinity" speakers and factory amp for rear fill rear

One last note, I've got a kenwood XXV-01D headunit that has good tuning ability (crossover, slope, etc.).

Thanks for your help! I'm really have no idea about this stuff.

takeabao
03-29-2006, 01:23 PM
Biamp your front-stage and ditch your rearfill completely -- you won't need it.

Unless your running an active setup, the "good tuning ability" on your Kenwood really isn't going to provide much tuning ability at all.

You have some GREAT equipment, but your primary concern should be to focus on proper installation and SOUND DEADENING.

Boosted Josh
03-29-2006, 03:56 PM
Takeabao, Even thought weight is a big concern of mine I've got a good bit of second skin coming and a pair of dynaxorb pads. It should be enough to do a couple of layers on the front doors.

I've got confidence in the guy who is doing the install.

So you really think that I can ditch the rears and not miss them, would having the rear deck speaker holes open let a little more bass in the cabin?

takeabao
03-29-2006, 04:00 PM
So you really think that I can ditch the rears and not miss them, would having the rear deck speaker holes open let a little more bass in the cabin?
Yes.

If you're worried about bass "leakage" (which really is a non-issue), you can keep your stock speakers there and NOT power 'em. Just deaden the hell out've your trunk / rear deck.

Boosted Josh
03-29-2006, 06:47 PM
Well I guess I'll have some **** **** crossovers that I won't be using then. That kinda ***** considering how nice they look though.

I'm not really worried about bass leakage, but rather hoping that I WOULD get a little more in the cabin considering I'm only running one 10.

squeak9798
03-29-2006, 06:54 PM
Rather than bi-amp, I would bridge that amplifier to your front speakers and not use any rear fill at all as takeabao mentioned.

takeabao
03-29-2006, 07:13 PM
Rather than bi-amp, I would bridge that amplifier to your front speakers
Not going to work since the JL 450/4 bridges to 300w/150w on the 1/2 and 3/4 channels...

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_amps.php?amp_id=255

squeak9798
03-29-2006, 07:19 PM
Not going to work since the JL 450/4 bridges to 300w/150w on the 1/2 and 3/4 channels...

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_amps.php?amp_id=255

Oh yeah....forgot about that :blush:

I just really don't see the point in bi-amping 90% of the time. Unless there is substantial gain in tuning...i.e. you need to do it to properly adjust the level between the mid/tweeter, the gain of independent time delay, etc....it's just a waste of power most other times. No use in expending 150w/side of amplifier power for no real gain in power at the speakers over 75w and not biamping.

jujumantb
03-29-2006, 07:24 PM
Oh yeah....forgot about that :blush:

I just really don't see the point in bi-amping 90% of the time. Unless there is substantial gain in tuning...i.e. you need to do it to properly adjust the level between the mid/tweeter, the gain of independent time delay, etc....it's just a waste of power most other times. No use in expending 150w/side of amplifier power for no real gain in power at the speakers over 75w and not biamping.
Totally agreed, it seems that many "wanna-be" audiophiles bi-amp just to be able to say they are bi-amping, while they really dont have the expertise (or equipment) to get any real gains out of it.

Boosted Josh
03-29-2006, 07:50 PM
I just want it to sound the best that it can; Bi-amped or not.

Squeak, are you saying that I should not even hook anything up to my 3/4 channels? If that is the case then I could just get a 2 channel amp.

I bought the 450/4 (along with a ton of other stuff) from a guy that never installed it and it still has 1.5 years of extended warranty left on it. I don't want to be "wasting" any power that the amp can provide. Is there a point in having a 450/4 if I'm only using half of it?

Is there a reason NOT to bi-amp it? The Q's shouldn't have a problem taking the power....right?

Hmmmm, now I'm more confused :)

Boosted Josh
03-29-2006, 07:53 PM
Specs on the QSD216's

Power Handling 90 - 170 W
Impedance 4 ohms
Sensitivity 2,6 W (90 dB/1m)
Frequency Response 35 - 32.000 Hz
Crossover Frequency 2.400 Hz
Crossover Slope 12/18 dB/octave



FEATURES

- Wet Powder Coating for the midrange cone
- Midrange with 37mm (1.5") voice coil - Former is made of Kapton foil (a temperature resistant plastic) that can withstand extreme heat
- Regardless of the wire size or type you can always connect to an MB QUART. Connection types include solder, screw-down, spade or bare wire.
- Designed specifically for low-profile installations, these die cast aluminium baskets can be installed in factory locations with little or no modification. They are lightweight but extremely rigid.
- Our unique performance enhancing BBalanced Temperature Technology (BTT) can be found in the tweeter and crossover.
- Bi-wiring and bi-amping capable
- Tweeter level can be adjusted by gold plated jumpers in 2dB steps up to -6dB
- A light bulb is incorporated into the Q crossover networks to extend the life of the tweeter by protecting it against overloading.
- Tweeter with a 25 mm (1") titanium dome with a highly elastic butyl rubber surround
- Multi-purpose mounting accessories are included
- Upgrade your midbass with the Add-A-Woofer-System

FoxPro5
03-29-2006, 08:02 PM
I just want it to sound the best that it can; Bi-amped or not.

Squeak, are you saying that I should not even hook anything up to my 3/4 channels? If that is the case then I could just get a 2 channel amp.

I bought the 450/4 (along with a ton of other stuff) from a guy that never installed it and it still has 1.5 years of extended warranty left on it. I don't want to be "wasting" any power that the amp can provide. Is there a point in having a 450/4 if I'm only using half of it?

Is there a reason NOT to bi-amp it? The Q's shouldn't have a problem taking the power....right?

Hmmmm, now I'm more confused :)

What they are saying Josh is that biamping is not going to yield THAT much better results than just running a high powered two channel or a 4 channel bridged. Since you already have the amp, by all means use it. And since you can't bridge it and the MBQ passives allow for bi-wiring, then go for it.

I guess If you had to do it all over again, then you might have thought about whether bi-amping would really benefit your install. For some it does, but for many it doesn't. A little light reading on the subject: http://www.audioasylum.com/audio/general/messages/57210.html

And no, you will not miss you rear speakers...especially with an Evo that wips so fast throught the turns, there is no way those sound waves will reach your ears anyway :D <--- that is a joke btw :p:

Boosted Josh
03-29-2006, 11:14 PM
Thanks for the link Fox. I read it, most of it made sense to me.

So, since the Q's are bi-amp/bi-wire capable, and I've got the amp to do it with there is no real reason I shouldn't do it.

One more silly question: because the Q's are bi-capable I will retain the crossover correct?

Thanks for all your help guys!

Oh yeah Fox, the evo's pretty quick but it doesn't have anything on my old 96 cobra 500rwhp 425rwtq, that thing was a beast.

squeak9798
03-29-2006, 11:24 PM
I just want it to sound the best that it can; Bi-amped or not.

Squeak, are you saying that I should not even hook anything up to my 3/4 channels? If that is the case then I could just get a 2 channel amp.

I bought the 450/4 (along with a ton of other stuff) from a guy that never installed it and it still has 1.5 years of extended warranty left on it. I don't want to be "wasting" any power that the amp can provide. Is there a point in having a 450/4 if I'm only using half of it?

Is there a reason NOT to bi-amp it? The Q's shouldn't have a problem taking the power....right?

Hmmmm, now I'm more confused :)

No use in bi-amping. If you use that amp...no, I would not hook anything up to channels 3&4. It probably won't *hurt* anything if you did bi-amp...but for you it appears to be simply little to no benefit in it. You aren't really gaining anything, in your situation, by bi-amping. The only possible benefit I can see is slightly more control in level matching the mids and tweeters. You aren't gaining any applied power to the speakers. You would actually be decreasing the "applied" power, since the tweeters would only have the potential of receving 75w as opposed to 150w if you did not bi-amp and only used the 150w channels for each side.

squeak9798
03-29-2006, 11:30 PM
Thanks for the link Fox. I read it, most of it made sense to me.

So, since the Q's are bi-amp/bi-wire capable, and I've got the amp to do it with there is no real reason I shouldn't do it.

One more silly question: because the Q's are bi-capable I will retain the crossover correct?

Thanks for all your help guys!

Oh yeah Fox, the evo's pretty quick but it doesn't have anything on my old 96 cobra 500rwhp 425rwtq, that thing was a beast.

Yes, you would use the supplied passive crossover still.

Boosted Josh
03-30-2006, 12:16 AM
Cool Squeak, I'm begining to understand the whole thing better now.

Thanks for everyones help it is much appreciated.

It's been over 10 years since I've done much with car audio. You know back in the day when lanzar amps were made in the USA and were beasts! :)