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thylantyr
02-19-2006, 04:50 PM
While trolling, found this. I never seen this before :clap:

http://www.feastrex.com/english/product.html

They have a 105dB sensitivity driver, 16 ohm.

Low powered tube users would get a boner.

req
02-19-2006, 05:45 PM
how much?

dakar8
02-19-2006, 09:13 PM
I think they are supposed to be in the same price range as lowthers when they come out. The naturflex being the most expensive.

dakar8
02-19-2006, 09:16 PM
Here's a link to more info on them

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=70709&highlight=

JimJ
02-19-2006, 10:26 PM
148,000 yen?

Little steep for my wallet :)

ss3079
02-19-2006, 10:29 PM
148,000 yen?

Little steep for my wallet :)

Yeah ... very much so.

azbass
02-19-2006, 10:30 PM
they have wizzer cones?

JimJ
02-19-2006, 11:15 PM
Fostex 166E's and 206E's have whizzer cones, as well.

They **** off axis unless you put a phase plug in there - there's actually a way to cut out the dustcap and install a little metal hex socket in there :D Looks ghetto, but the magnet holds the socket in there and works as a phase plug ;)

There's a guy in Ontario that has a neat little business carving custom phase plugs for 'em as well.

azbass
02-19-2006, 11:17 PM
pretty nifty

JimJ
02-19-2006, 11:20 PM
Still...$1200 for 105dB/W drivers isn't all that great.

For that kind of money, I'd build a huge line array and blow my ears off with it :)

Or build a pair of Nelson Pass Kleinhorns, and do the same thing...hehe

joetama
02-20-2006, 02:32 AM
I'm glad you are measuring the value of a system by it's sensitivity lol... These would sound good if you don't like solid high and low freqency responce (one driver)....

ngsm13
02-20-2006, 03:46 AM
35hz-23kHz @-10dB???

GHEY?

nG

PV Audio
02-20-2006, 01:48 PM
Too expensive, not enough performance. Unless they'll jack me off and wash my clothes I'd rather get a hooker.

joetama
02-20-2006, 04:39 PM
****, in my speakers which sound very good might I add, There are 2 speakers for freqs below 350Hz, one for 350Hz-4000Hz and then one from 4k to god knows where.... Plus if you add the sub that goes from 15Hz- 110Hz I got alot of speakers....

JimJ
02-20-2006, 04:41 PM
Some people really like the one-driver-for-everything approach, though I feel that you really can't rely on a 6" or 8" to provide useful subbass. You at least need a subwoofer to take care of the bottom octaves.

joetama
02-20-2006, 04:43 PM
For me, high end is the most important part of the sound, so I just don't see how a 6" could effecently produce anything above 3-4k. I know the box makes a hude difference but, still if it wont move that fast how is it going to have a good clean responce up into 10k or 15k?

squeak9798
02-20-2006, 05:57 PM
still if it wont move that fast how is it going to have a good clean responce up into 10k or 15k?

The ability to "move that fast" is limited by the inductance, not the cone diameter. And most full range drivers like that will have incredibly low inductance, hence allowing for high frequency extension.

PV Audio
02-20-2006, 06:02 PM
Wouldn't it also have to do with the Bl of the speaker and the mms? I don't really know, I'm just wondering.

I like the full range approach because my room images like **** in a house of mirrors during a hurricane. I don't have to blend 3 or 2 different cones to get a good image, it's all coming out of one. You also don't have to worry as much about beaming as well.

joetama
02-20-2006, 06:02 PM
Still you generate lots of distortion when you have such a large cone area moving so fast. There is a reason why you don’t have many tweeters that are 5 or 6 inches. The excursion is less but there is lots more mass and resistance that doesn't need to be there to generate the acoustic output. That is what my point was.

joetama
02-20-2006, 06:05 PM
Wouldn't it also have to do with the Bl of the speaker and the mms? I don't really know, I'm just wondering.

I like the full range approach because my room images like **** in a house of mirrors during a hurricane. I don't have to blend 3 or 2 different cones to get a good image, it's all coming out of one. You also don't have to worry as much about beaming as well.

The imaging is done at the face of the speaker. The room makes a difference but when it comes down to it it's all about what it does at the face of the speaker, unless of course your outup pattern is 160x60 or 20x30 lol...

squeak9798
02-20-2006, 06:05 PM
Still you generate lots of distortion when you have such a large cone area moving so fast. There is a reason why you don’t have many tweeters that are 5 or 6 inches. The excursion is less but there is lots more mass and resistance that doesn't need to be there to generate the acoustic output. That is what my point was.

Yes, the cone will likely have some resonances and such that will contribute to distortion....but that's not what you said :D The ability to physically move that fast is related primarily to inductance. Whether or not it'll sound good moving that fast is a whole nother issue.......

Plus beaming would be an issue (another reason for no large coned tweeters). I'm not sure how well the whizzer combats this issue.

PV Audio
02-20-2006, 06:10 PM
The imaging is done at the face of the speaker. The room makes a difference but when it comes down to it it's all about what it does at the face of the speaker, unless of course your outup pattern is 160x60 or 20x30 lol...
Ok then, let me rephrase that. My room is all corners, vaults and other retarded acoustical masterpieces. I can get ZERO soundstage out of it, and to make the cones blend together into a single image is even more difficult because the sound is completely ****ed by the shape. It's a trapezoidal ceiling aidn kind of hexagonal with a lil alcove in the back. You can flush mount, roundover and put the cones as close as you want, but once the sound reaches you, it's already nearly destroyed. I just listen for the detail in the cones now instead of being immersed in the sound. Hope that makes sense :crap:

PV Audio
02-20-2006, 06:12 PM
Yes, the cone will likely have some resonances and such that will contribute to distortion....but that's not what you said :D The ability to physically move that fast is related primarily to inductance. Whether or not it'll sound good moving that fast is a whole nother issue.......

Plus beaming would be an issue (another reason for no large coned tweeters). I'm not sure how well the whizzer combats this issue.
I don't know about beaming, but the off axis response from a whizzer sounds worse than Tom Jones getting raped by a gorilla.

joetama
02-20-2006, 06:16 PM
Not that it matters but, the point was simply that there is no way that ONE driver can produce high frequency and low frequency together efficiently at the same time and sound good.... Anyway, inductance, cone mass, and cone size and other figures all make up what frequency range a driver will effectively operate in.

joetama
02-20-2006, 06:17 PM
Ok then, let me rephrase that. My room is all corners, vaults and other retarded acoustical masterpieces. I can get ZERO soundstage out of it, and to make the cones blend together into a single image is even more difficult because the sound is completely ****ed by the shape. It's a trapezoidal ceiling aidn kind of hexagonal with a lil alcove in the back. You can flush mount, roundover and put the cones as close as you want, but once the sound reaches you, it's already nearly destroyed. I just listen for the detail in the cones now instead of being immersed in the sound. Hope that makes sense :crap:

Sounds like you need a good set of cans lol....

PV Audio
02-20-2006, 06:24 PM
Sounds like you need a good set of cans lol....
Yeah dude, I almost bought some Grados bue then I dropped 4 bills on 4 D6gs and some Vifa tweets. Sounded good, but NOT good enough.

dakar8
02-20-2006, 07:29 PM
Not that it matters but, the point was simply that there is no way that ONE driver can produce high frequency and low frequency together efficiently at the same time and sound good....

If there's no way it can sound good why do audiophile people spend the time to make transmission lines and folded horns for that exact purpose? If you have enough room for the box necessary to get good lowend out of a fullrange then it's totally possible ;)

JimJ
02-20-2006, 07:35 PM
If there's no way it can sound good why do audiophile people spend the time to make transmission lines and folded horns for that exact purpose? If you have enough room for the box necessary to get good lowend out of a fullrange then it's totally possible ;)

TL's have a decent low end, but horns have quite the ragged low bass reponse. I wouldn't play them much below 50Hz or so before things start to get iffy. Still, I think you should have a solid subwoofer for something like this.

As for the highs, the beaming issue is the only one I really have with it - the actual tonal quality is fine if you're relatively on-axis or have large phase plugs. But going to a 6" or smaller driver will help a ton.

PV Audio
02-20-2006, 07:37 PM
My phase plugs > your phase plugs.

joetama
02-20-2006, 08:24 PM
A lot of the "audiophile" people do things just to do them. Guys who grew up on Klipsch corner horns will build folded horn systems or corner reflectors just because that's what they want. However, they might not be the cleanest and sharpest sounding device. I believe as John Bowers said a speaker system shouldn't give the most it should take away the least. With horns there is added distortion and phasing issues it is just a given and pretty understood. Let me see, to get 30 Hz out of a true horn design (least amount of distortion added) you need a horn mouth opening of 45 square feet. This is nine time five; if you do you have a living room big enough for that type of system you prolly aren’t a member of this forum and should be on the Rolls Royce forum lol… But, if you tune your horn to have low end response then it won’t be tuned for high end response. CD horns only work over a certain frequency range; they would be too big to be full range. When 2*(A*pi)^.5 is > than the wavelength, where A = mouth area of the horn, then the horn loads properly but when it is < or = to then the horn does not “load” properly and becomes unstable at that frequency. A folded horn system takes less volume but adds more distortion. The reason for a horn systems originally being developed was drivers were not that efficient and were lets say 15 Watts max power and even when 30 and 40 Watt drivers were developed they still did not produce enough volume to be used without horns. Point being horns don’t sound bad; they can sound very very good, but will not have the response and quality of an efficient multi driver system.

the_joker
02-21-2006, 04:49 AM
I have heard some full range drivers that sound pretty good.

joetama
02-21-2006, 04:57 AM
Do you like that Queens of the Stoneage Album songs for the Deaf? lol, just kidding....

ballstothewall
02-21-2006, 10:44 AM
Hey man, watch where your poking around with fullrange comments.....

hehe