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View Full Version : Dayton RS Debucking Problem!



PRIVATEpastry
09-22-2005, 05:55 PM
I just got done debucking one of my two Dayton RS 6" woofers. It seems that the middle rod dealie (phase plug?) has come off center and now the cone is not able to move! If anyone has had this happen to them or knows how to fix it, please help me out.

Thanks in advance.

squeak9798
09-22-2005, 08:39 PM
Phase plugs are generally attached to the pole piece. If you shifted the phase plug, then either you knocked it loose or you knocked the bottom plate out of alignment.

PRIVATEpastry
09-22-2005, 09:19 PM
Yeah, I was talking to Dylan about it. The glue on the back plate came undone, so it got knocked out of alignment. He said I could knock it back into alignment, but it would be hard.

I tried this, he wasn't lying...

squeak9798
09-22-2005, 09:50 PM
This is one of the problems with trying to debuck the speakers.....things can go wrong.

Fortunately within the next 2-3mos Dayton is supposed to be releasing 4ohm buckless Reference drivers. Should cure much of these problems.

Wonder if Dylan is working on a crossover plan for them....hmmm.....

OlogyAudio
09-23-2005, 01:05 PM
This is one of the problems with trying to debuck the speakers.....things can go wrong.

Fortunately within the next 2-3mos Dayton is supposed to be releasing 4ohm buckless Reference drivers. Should cure much of these problems.

Wonder if Dylan is working on a crossover plan for them....hmmm.....
Indeed... :) I hate having to deal with debucking all the time too...

I'm still in a tossup between 2 designs for the RS drivers... -- high sensitivity low qes higher vas -- or a lower sensitivity (about 5dB less) ~ .7 qes or so... that has better midbass out of the box -- no EQ required (or ported kicks) -- Will make my midrange of the high sensitivity variety for sure... Everything DVC 4 ohm.

squeak9798
09-23-2005, 01:09 PM
Way I look at it....power's cheap. Sensitivity, for most people, isn't an issue unless they are trying to mate something with either horns or ribbons.

Majority of car audio enthusiasts would prefer enhanced midbass/lower sensitivity

JimJ
09-23-2005, 01:11 PM
Way I look at it....power's cheap. Sensitivity, for most people, isn't an issue unless they are trying to mate something with either horns or ribbons.

Majority of car audio enthusiasts would prefer enhanced midbass/lower sensitivity

Quite true. 12VDC power is cost effective enough that you can afford sending assloads of power to the speakers.

At home, the opposite applies :)

OlogyAudio
09-23-2005, 01:32 PM
Way I look at it....power's cheap. Sensitivity, for most people, isn't an issue unless they are trying to mate something with either horns or ribbons.

Majority of car audio enthusiasts would prefer enhanced midbass/lower sensitivity

Indeed -- :) -- one pair with 300 watts going to each would churn out ~118dB -- while the other would be putting about 123dB – granted power is cheap but running over 300 into these things will cause the magic smoke to be released… Unless you know what you are doing I wouldn’t even run 300… 150-200 is safer :) and plenty loud.

Relying on cabin gain the .7 would remain flat more or less down to 20hz... just excursion limited under 84hz (figuring 80 watts RMS as the 100h thermal limit)

On the other hand for the lower q -- if someone could accommodate a .3-.45 cuft kick tuned to about 55hz... the f3 is 70hz -- f6 is 50hz... (this is all based upon the .45cuft kick – a slightly higher tuning of ~60hz will do better for the .3cuft… and shift these numbers up accordingly) -- excursion limited under 45hz though.

IB it doesn't do so hot though...
f3 is 130hz f6 is 85hz -- so you would want about 3dB of boost at 130hz -- and again at 80hz (expecting cabin gain to start picking it up a little bit here -- so 3-5dB of boost depending)

It is excursion limited at 70hz IB with 80 watts of power... granted with EQ every 3dB of boost you are doubling the amplifier power... so keep that in mind.

Mid 110s down to 50hz with a pair of front comps though just sounds **** to me. Possibly I'll start out with the .7 for more 'average' installs and make a run of the other drivers with some improvements and sell them in a more high end set where the customer would be more open to a more custom install to get the best sound possible later down the line... using exotic materials :)

squeak9798
09-23-2005, 06:49 PM
If you start off with something designated for tuned kicks, you'll have 75% of your customer base tossing them psuedo-IB in their doors, then cussing you out and leaving bad reviews all over the 'net :p:

Best way to go, initially, is the high-Q more IB & midbass/low sensitivity oriented driver.

Do what Rainbow does. Have one version the "regular" version (high Q), then another version with the same model # only with "kickbass" or something tagged onto the end (low Q for ported kicks) :D

AzGrower
09-24-2005, 09:35 AM
Will the new designs cause the pricetag to go up? Also, what information can you provide us with the Dayton RS subs? I am really thinking about ordering the 10 HF, but am wondering if a ported box will work okay with this one, or should I get the HO sub? My main concern is having SQL.

squeak9798
09-24-2005, 01:52 PM
Will the new designs cause the pricetag to go up? Also, what information can you provide us with the Dayton RS subs? I am really thinking about ordering the 10 HF, but am wondering if a ported box will work okay with this one, or should I get the HO sub? My main concern is having SQL.


I haven't used either; but just by looking at the descriptions and specs, the HO series is more suited for vehicle use. If you look at the Vas...the Vas on the HF is almost double that of the HO, which means in general the HF would need a much larger enclosure (almost double the size).

That was just from a quick glance.

OlogyAudio
09-25-2005, 06:01 PM
Will the new designs cause the pricetag to go up? Also, what information can you provide us with the Dayton RS subs? I am really thinking about ordering the 10 HF, but am wondering if a ported box will work okay with this one, or should I get the HO sub? My main concern is having SQL.
Both would sound awesome... I doubt you would hear much of a difference in sound quality between the HO and HF... the HO may end up being more appropriate in car sealed... will match in with cabin gain a little better than the HF in a typical box

The HF version needs a larger box... It actually would be interesting installed in a wall IB :) -- may need some EQ though I haven't looked at them that hard yet

About the new designs...

The standard Dayton RS car drivers are of the higher Q variety :) -- I'll just work with those when they finally come out.

The new designs, along with more volume will cause the costs to go down... Having dealers and a general distributor will cause prices to go up though in the end due to those markups... As long as I can keep my prices lower than the competition's (read rainbow) equivalent and still make good money I'll be happy... and so will everyone else :)

I'm putting most of my time into school and home audio at the moment :) -- atleast untill something awesome happens in this world :naughty:

Berry47
09-26-2005, 09:25 PM
I had this EXACT problem a couple months ago.

I followed all the instructions but I guess some of the newer ones have stonger glue holding the shielding then they do the backing plate and phase plug assembly.

Approach this idea with caution if anyone plans on doing so....

Wait until the unshielded version comes out.

PRIVATEpastry
09-26-2005, 09:28 PM
So... I went out and bought a "sharp chisel" like they tell you to use. It debucked my remaining unharmed RS like a charm. :D

OlogyAudio
09-26-2005, 10:34 PM
So... I went out and bought a "sharp chisel" like they tell you to use. It debucked my remaining unharmed RS like a charm. :D
:veryhapp: :veryhapp: it is all in the tools :)