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View Full Version : XXX mids sounding muddy... check my setup



cappy72
08-28-2005, 08:39 AM
Ok I recently noticed that my mids sound a little muddy, I dont want to say that its distortion but its not really that clear. I have a three.1 and a D6 600.4 amp, which can be bandpassed...

If I set the LPF on the amp to approx 2000hz its kills all higher vocals and I have to lower it to approx 1000hz or it sounds like $hit. I have the HPF set to approx 80hz... so the range should be between 80-1000hz...

I know that people say that the mids can handle sounds up to 2500-3500hz but when I shut off the LPF it sounds a little better but still harsh. Any thoughts???



Another thing that I wanted to question... I just put my XXX12 in a sealed box and it sounds like the dust cap is shaking and when I hold the top of the rubber surround it stops... but it wasnt doing this in the ported box that I had???

BCONNELLY
08-28-2005, 08:56 AM
Tell me more about your set-up...

I'm assuming you're using components, how are they wired (off 2 or 4 channels, are the tweets shareing a channel with the mids, or split to 4 channels)? I assume that's with the Diamond D6.

What components are you running?

How did you set the freq. for your sub, the sub can add alot to your mid (at lest you'll think your mid is producing tremendous bass, if it's balanced witht the sub and vise versus)

Tell me more, then I can help a little better.

cappy72
08-28-2005, 09:14 AM
i have the tweets from Deserheat... the mids are on 2 seperate channels, the tweets are on the other 2... this is powered by the D6 amp

I have XXX mids in the doors that are deadened.

my sub is in a sealed box with filter around 90hz...

BCONNELLY
08-28-2005, 10:25 AM
What is your goal? Are you striving more for SQ or SPL or a bit of a balance
I'm looking for about 70% SQ to 30% SPL, I found that the subsonic filter for my sub amp took away from the midrange imaging.

What are you using to crossover you tweets and mids, the amps crossover? This could be part of the problem. I dunno, I'm still a bit of a noob...

I am not using the LPF or HPF for my components, I am relying on the componets crossovers

For my sub, I am not using the subsonic filter, instead with the LPF, I tuned it up until I could hear my low end midrange start to blend between my door mids and my subs.
This will take away from your spl a little but will bring out the bass in your components. Really improves your imaging.

Maybe an electronic crossover would help, since you (probably, just a guess) are using the crossovers in the amp. IMO...

cappy72
08-28-2005, 11:47 AM
i have a 3 way crossover for the tweets but I disconnected the mids from that because of the functionality of the amp...

ngsm13
08-28-2005, 01:10 PM
Well, can the 3.1 crossover bandpass the mids?

I think the problem is that internal xovers on amps are not the best, they usually have shallow slopes...like 12dB/Oct.

I have:
- XXX 6.5's
- Vifa 1" Neodymium Textile Dome Tweeters
- Kicker KX 450.2
- Kicker KX 200.2
- Alpine 9835 running 3-way Active Xover

On my HU, I have my XXX's crossed over at 1.6kHz w/ a 24 dB/oct slope on it. With a shallower slope, even 18dB/oct it starts to sound muddy :(. But at the moment, I believe mine sound great.

NG

ngsm13
08-28-2005, 01:16 PM
As far as the cone "rattling"...RE subs have an "internal" dustcap, like a former cap that cover the top of the former. Then the large Dustcap that is smooth and you see that has the logo on it. You MAY be having a problem with the internal being loose...MAYBE...I've seen it happen before...and it took us about 4 hours to figure out that's what it was.

NG

OlogyAudio
08-28-2005, 01:57 PM
it is a property of these guys... xover *needs to be lower than 1khz -- 4th order is best*

Linear distortion is a pig...

XXX = needs 3 way for anyone that values SQ... said it many times :) -- if ya want some advice on what would be best for ya, just send a PM :)

Raven
08-28-2005, 02:13 PM
Nonsense, XXX up to 1200hz at 24 db/octave and a decent compression horn driver from 1200 to 20k would work wonders as a 2 way SQ setup. =)

OlogyAudio
08-28-2005, 03:37 PM
Nonsense, XXX up to 1200hz at 24 db/octave and a decent compression horn driver from 1200 to 20k would work wonders as a 2 way SQ setup. =)

indeed or ribbon but that tends to be out of the league that most people can manage... both horns and ribbons have their issues for a typical car install :) -- granted you can have ethr of them work with some effort... ends up costing about the same to get a nice 3 way though lol...

T3mpest
08-28-2005, 05:36 PM
your midrange would still be off anway, not exactly a SQ install, more of an SQL. No mid is going to play up to 1200hz and still keep up with a compression driver anway, horns are still best used in a 3 way, IMO.

mega1268
08-28-2005, 05:43 PM
ngsm u have ur tweets playing down to 1.3 khz? tahts alittle low for those vifas no?

ngsm13
08-28-2005, 10:06 PM
I have my tweets at around 2kHz highpass, and the mids at around 1.6kHz lowpass. Can't remember the EXACT frequencies.

NG

cappy72
08-29-2005, 08:37 AM
Ok so I am thinking something like this:

I take the xxx6.5's and cut them off around 800-1000hz
get a set of something like this for the higher notes and a smoother transition into the tweet range:
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=297-340
setting the freq to somewhere around 200hz-4000hz

and then setting the tweets from 3500hz- 10000000000hz...

any thoughts?

3.5Max6spd
08-29-2005, 09:44 AM
I think one of your issues lies in POWER, those mids are not super efficient to amaze you with the power you are giving them- thats a 75rms x4 amp, and at 8ohm that mid is seeing half that.

I'm not surprised, some people claimed they had superb midrange, i was thoroughly disappointed with them myself at a recent meet......high expectations considering the bonerage behind them....my 8's have better midrange up to 2500hz imo

cappy72
08-29-2005, 03:00 PM
i am confused about what you are talking about??? are you referring to the partsexpress mid or the xxx6.5? the partsexpress mid is 8ohms but its 15rms

OlogyAudio
08-29-2005, 03:40 PM
i am confused about what you are talking about??? are you referring to the partsexpress mid or the xxx6.5? the partsexpress mid is 8ohms but its 15rms
What is your tweeter? -- that parts express mid isn't that hot for this sort of use...

cappy72
08-29-2005, 04:04 PM
i have the aura tweets from desert heat