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Decado
07-25-2005, 06:38 PM
Ok, so i have a pioneer vsx-d466s reciever 5x100 watt system, and 2 klh v5001 speakers (325 watt max, 12" woofer, 12"passive radiator, 5.25"mid, 7/8"tweeter) and i was wondering if there would be any way to amplify the power to those speakers until i can afford a better preamp, amp, etc; maybe just a cheap 300 watt per channel amp or something that i can hook up through the stereo with the speaker connections. If anyone has any ideas can they get back to me please? Thx.

creater
07-25-2005, 07:18 PM
buy a cheap plate amp from PE...or a used amp off of ebay...or just hook up a car amp there

Decado
07-25-2005, 08:19 PM
how do i hook up a car amp there, and how do i get the ohms right?

JimJ
07-25-2005, 08:42 PM
I'm not sure I understand your question.

You said you already have a 5-channel receiver - do you mean you're looking to increase the power over that? There really isn't a good way to do that short of upgrading the receiver itself.

Honestly, going with higher efficiency speakers might be a better choice.

Decado
07-25-2005, 09:56 PM
Ya, i'm just lookin for a cheap way to up the power until i can afford some good speakers, uhh, i guess the car amp would be pretty stupid because it wouldnt work getting the ohms right, but with the plate amp how would i hook that up? just (for example with the right speaker) hook the right channel wire into the hi level input on the plate amplifier and hook the speaker up with the wires on the side of the amp you would normally hook you're subwoofer up to, then just dont hook anything up to the high level output?

creater
07-25-2005, 10:06 PM
you are confusing me...maybe its because its late...but it sounds rite...

Decado
07-25-2005, 10:45 PM
Hehe, ok to be less confusing, can you tell me how i would hook my speakers up to plate amps (1 amp per speaker so i can get stereo still).

JimJ
07-25-2005, 10:47 PM
I still wouldn't do it.

Unless you're getting a hell of a deal, you're still going to spend $100 each for the plate amps, so that puts you in the range of a new receiver - which will allow you to do the job without resorting to ghetto-rigging it :D

Decado
07-25-2005, 10:49 PM
you can get recievers that send 300+ watts to each channel?

Prowler573
07-25-2005, 10:57 PM
you can get recievers that send 300+ watts to each channel?
The quick answer is 'Yes.'

However, probably not in a $2-300 price point.

Are you not caring for the sound of the speakers you have being driven by 100 watts? That's the same output as my Technics receiver ~ with its sub channel driving a pair of 10s (with only 50w/each) and it sounds fine. What exactly are you trying to gain by upping the available power?

Decado
07-25-2005, 10:59 PM
Uhh, louder sound i guess, but by the way you guys make it sound i might as well wait and get some better speakers and buy some subs. What do most people do, get bookshelf speakers and a subwoofer or what?

JimJ
07-25-2005, 11:00 PM
What exactly are you trying to gain by upping the available power?

Because people don't like the lower power/higher efficiency speaker route for some reason :D

My advice? Get a receiver that does a solid 100+ watts unclipped per channel, and speakers that are 90-92dB/W efficient. If that's truly not loud enough for you, it's time to move to pro audio amplifiers like QSC or Crown.

JimJ
07-25-2005, 11:01 PM
What do most people do, get bookshelf speakers and a subwoofer or what?

Yes.

Decado
07-25-2005, 11:03 PM
6.5" woofer and 4" tweeter on the bookshelves? And coupled with the subs will this sound better than if i had a 12" woofer, 6.5" mid, and a tweeter?

JimJ
07-25-2005, 11:09 PM
4" tweet? Using horns, I take it?

Two way systems have less to go wrong, so in that regard they're easier to work with...but three way systems can sound very good.

Decado
07-25-2005, 11:11 PM
Ok, so what would i use in a 3 way system (sizes, watts, w/e), and could you tell me some good brands to use for these?

JimJ
07-25-2005, 11:14 PM
What's your budget?

There are plenty of options out there...Madisound.com & Parts Express would be good places to start your search.

JimJ
07-25-2005, 11:15 PM
Another advantage to two way systems is that they're usually cheaper, so it's helpful if you're on a tight budget. Less crossover parts, less drivers, that sort of thing.

Decado
07-25-2005, 11:36 PM
What are some good brands? I have no idea man. I think i'll go for a 3 way system, what kind of speakers do i get in a 3 way system.

creater
07-25-2005, 11:47 PM
check PE...most of the brands they have there i trust....just look at something you like...

a 3 way system has one speaker bringing out the lows/bass....another bringing out the mids...and something bringin out the mids/highs...like horns

a 12"sub, 8/ 6.5" would go nice for mids and a good horn for mids/highs

Decado
07-25-2005, 11:50 PM
Ok, so are you talking about speakers under the prosound section or the home section? Because i'll be running this off a 100 watt per channel reciever.

JimJ
07-26-2005, 12:00 AM
Home section.

Decado
07-26-2005, 12:06 AM
How does this look?

woofer - http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=290-105

mid - http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=280-045

tweeter - http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=270-034

creater
07-26-2005, 12:24 AM
the mids look nice...the tweet looks good...the sub looks good...

N.B. looks good for the power that you are goin to be sending them


sure why dont you give it a shot

Decado
07-26-2005, 12:30 AM
Ok, so do you think those will sound better and be louder than my KLH speakers? And i'm also going to need help with 2 more things from you guys, what do i do for crossovers for those speakers, and how do i wire them inside the box?

TeenWolf
07-26-2005, 12:43 AM
Many people go with the bookshelf speakers and a sub. I wouldn't be so concerned about the power. As Jack Frost said, 100w RMS without clipping is plenty. My receiver spits out 110w RMS min and it fires out more power than I could ever want. So much that my 200w RMS speakers can't handle it.

Decado
07-26-2005, 12:46 AM
Ok, so now you're just confusing me, do you mean a 3 way bookshelf speaker and a subwoofer? Do i use 2 mid's and a tweeter on a bookshelf speaker? Or a small woofer, a mid and a tweeter?

creater
07-26-2005, 12:52 AM
im tired....i'll let jack take that one

JimJ
07-26-2005, 12:58 AM
He means a bookshelf speaker - which could be anything, really...

creater
07-26-2005, 12:59 AM
he must mean 2 way bookshelf and a sub...

or 3 way bookshelf would be a tweet and 2 mids...

and 100w/ch is a lot...i mean you arent looking for heavy equipment from peavy, QSC, Crown etc...

if you go with the bookshelf and sub i would say go with the 2 way and a good sub...

but just stick with the 3 way setup and ur good...forget about 2 way and sub

Decado
07-26-2005, 01:02 AM
Hehe, ok, thx, thats what i preferred anyways. One more question, would the cabinet i have for my klh speakers do fine? It's about 4.5 cubic feet and it has the spots for all the speakers, but it is not ported...it does however have a passive radiator, so, do you think this will work out for me? Because i'm not on a big budget. Ohh ya, and almost forgot again, what do i do for the crossovers and how do i wire it?

creater
07-26-2005, 01:02 AM
and about crossovers...PE has some nice 3 way crossovers

TeenWolf
07-26-2005, 01:03 AM
You're making your own speakers? Sounds like fun, but might be more work than you think. When I was talking about bookshelf speakers and a sub, I was referring to bookshelf cabinets that already have speakers in them, which you just have to "plug in" to your stereo. As for the sub woofer...I was referring to a powered sub that is already in a cabinet with its own amp. Again, not one you have to make.

Speaker cabinets usually contain 2 drivers: a tweeter and a sub. Subs in speakers don't drive the bass that a powered sub woofer can, and this is why may people have powered sub woofers, which are seperate from the speaker cabinets. Some speakers are 3 way, which have a mid range driver.

If you know very little about speakers, than it probably isn't a good idea to make your own. And certainly not a 3 way set. They require crossovers, which direct the correct frequency of sound to each driver. As I said, sounds like a fun project and you will learn lots, but I don't think you will get the sound that you are seeking.

creater
07-26-2005, 01:04 AM
the crossover i think would go in the box...

creater
07-26-2005, 01:05 AM
teen wolf...i think this guys on a real tight budget

Decado
07-26-2005, 01:05 AM
@creater, which crossover should i get, i dont understand the frequencies, should i get a 500/4000 hz, a 760/5600 hz? I dont understand that part of it.

creater
07-26-2005, 01:15 AM
im just as quizical about that crossover frequency thing a little

i guess the 500/4000hz


jack should be able to answer

Decado
07-26-2005, 01:32 AM
while i wait for jack, when i hook the speakers up to the crossover are there hookups on the crossover that label which connection is for what frequency? And, do you think that this speaker setup will sound better and be louder than the klh ones i have now? Because if it isnt going to it would be really pointless to do this.

JimJ
07-26-2005, 01:35 AM
teen wolf...i think this guys on a real tight budget

You can be on a tight budget and have knowledge, or you can have no knowledge and have no budget :) But you can't be on a tight budget with no knowledge...

Checking out forums like DIYaudio.com will give you a better idea of what's in store if you go the DIY route.

Xover points will depend entirely on the drivers chosen.

creater
07-26-2005, 01:43 AM
im fallin asleep...i cant think straight mang...peace

Decado
07-26-2005, 01:48 AM
Ok, well i dont know what the crossover points for the speakers i chose would be. For the speakers that i listed on page 2, would i want the 375/3000 hz, the 500/4000hz, the 625/5000hz, or the 700/5600 hz one.

creater
07-26-2005, 01:17 PM
375/3000hz sounds good!!!

Decado
07-26-2005, 03:58 PM
Alright, but can you tell me why that would sound good, just so i understand.

creater
07-26-2005, 05:11 PM
well the rest of the xover points would bring out more range through the woofer...if im not mistaken...the 375/3000hz gives less range from the woofer and brings a good frequency range to the mids...the xover point for the mid-treble is 3000hz so there would be mid-treble comin out along with the highs...

but before you go and start shopping you should get a second opp...from jack or someone

Decado
07-26-2005, 08:28 PM
Ok, thx man.

Decado
07-26-2005, 08:53 PM
Well, i talked to a guy on the diyaudio forums and he said the crossover points on the drivers i chose would get 700/5600, that way i stay a little above the 500 min on the mid, and it has a bigger range between the mid and the tweet. Uhh, i guess it seems right to me now, jack, what do you think?

creater
07-26-2005, 09:56 PM
well it sounds practical...

jack should be able to give any heads up

JimJ
07-26-2005, 11:10 PM
I don't mess with this crossover ****, takes up too much power for me :D

The guys on DIYaudio know their ****. If you've got a consensus, I'd go with their numbers first and play around with component values if you don't exactly like the sound.

Decado
07-26-2005, 11:10 PM
Alright, 700/5600 it is.

JimJ
07-26-2005, 11:20 PM
And you had better post pics...or we'll take your lunch money and say bad things about your mother.

Decado
07-27-2005, 01:56 AM
Hehe, ok.