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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Elvenking View Post
    I actually was looking at that little 7-band Clarion unit and it was nice looking because it would be reasonably low cost to try out. I just have to look around in my Sentra for a good mounting place. Maybe it could go where the old factory 5 disc changer is right now. Another good option...thanks.
    Dont even bother with those EQs, that piece of junk just cuts and screws with the music quality, not really bringing much to the table in terms of precision sound control. Get a good head unit, makes 100X more difference in killing the shrills or whatever then that clarion EQ could have ever done for me. Snag an 80prs man.



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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    I like my Audison Bit One and want to try a Helix P or C DSP just to see what they have to play around with.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Problem i see here is that you think an EQ is going to solve the problem when it's most likely other factors contributing.



    "When I listen to a stereo loudspeaker playback in my room and an auditory scene has formed in my mind, how would I know that what I hear is an accurate replica of an auditory scene that could be had at the recording venue? Or more generally, that this is an auditory scene that could have existed at all?"


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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffdachef View Post
    Dont even bother with those EQs, that piece of junk just cuts and screws with the music quality, not really bringing much to the table in terms of precision sound control. Get a good head unit, makes 100X more difference in killing the shrills or whatever then that clarion EQ could have ever done for me. Snag an 80prs man.
    Yeah, I am hearing ya. I really don't have a place to mount stuff like that for convenience anyway. As a couple are suggesting....the PRS80 would seem to be a better step up and not totally break the bank....plus I am sure I could reclaim money on the Alpine as well. The fact that you have Killswitch Engage as your avatar would seem to indicate that you have wrestled with the same kind of things.
    Last edited by Elvenking; 05-09-2014 at 12:36 PM.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by calebkhill View Post
    Problem i see here is that you think an EQ is going to solve the problem when it's most likely other factors contributing.
    Hopefully you can see how this statement doesn't help me at all. So you are just going to hold on to all the great information you have? Why not tell me the factors if you have em. I am not sure you are reading much of what I am typing. I get great sound the vast majority of stuff I play. I am not far off from maximizing the SQ I can get from the setup. But I am certainly not going to be able to build pods into the car and things like that if that is what you are suggesting. But you are suggesting nothing and simply guessing. So I am under the impression you are here to troll around.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Elvenking View Post
    Hopefully you can see how this statement doesn't help me at all. So you are just going to hold on to all the great information you have? Why not tell me the factors if you have em. I am not sure you are reading much of what I am typing. I get great sound the vast majority of stuff I play. I am not far off from maximizing the SQ I can get from the setup. But I am certainly not going to be able to build pods into the car and things like that if that is what you are suggesting. But you are suggesting nothing and simply guessing. So I am under the impression you are here to troll around.
    Ok.
    Do you use time alignment?
    Have you level matched?
    Have you used band limited pink noise?
    What are your crossover points and slopes?
    You said the speakers are wired in phase, how did you go about that?
    Where are your speakers installed and how are their mounting locations treated?
    At what volume levels are you playing.
    Is your entire system wired in stereo?



    "When I listen to a stereo loudspeaker playback in my room and an auditory scene has formed in my mind, how would I know that what I hear is an accurate replica of an auditory scene that could be had at the recording venue? Or more generally, that this is an auditory scene that could have existed at all?"


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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Thank you immensely for the questions.

    Do you use time alignment? I am trying to determine if my head unit has time alignment as of last night....just about to go out there now and see if it is tweakable with my deck. I feel this would be a great adjustment!

    Have you level matched? Not sure what is meant by this. Please educate me. If you mean matching the levels of the amps, then yes...as good as possible. I didn't see any reason to adjust L/R levels due to the fact that will create a single listening point.

    Have you used band limited pink noise? I have used both pink noise to get initially flat, and then a sine generator to kill exaggerated freqs.

    What are your crossover points and slopes? I often change this depending on the amount of low frequency information in the recording. Some of the things I listen too are older and have crappy, CRAPPY low end. So I will turn the Xover way down to allow a little more of that to pass through the front speakers...but I usually set that around 80 or 120 and let a bit more of the bass pass through the sub for rock. For stuff with a lot of bottom end...I will take it closer to the 80-60Hz cutoff because I don't want higher freqs interfering with the purity of the lows in those cases.

    You said the speakers are wired in phase, how did you go about that? Multimeter and polarity test on my phone app AudioTools with calibrated mic.

    Where are your speakers installed and how are their mounting locations treated? Locations are treated with heavy Dynamat and mounted with 6.5 in lower foot area of door...factory location. Tweets are on the pillars by the windshield. Those might be able to get better mounting. They sound pretty good and dead there. Maybe not ideal...but like I said...not sure how to go about pods and that.

    At what volume levels are you playing. As loud as I can get without hurting my ears. Which incidentally is fine and loud with most stuff. Like I said, The newly matered CD's post 2000 are another story. Very very compressed and crappy from the loudness wars.

    Is your entire system wired in stereo? Comps are in stereo and the bass is mono.
    Last edited by Elvenking; 05-09-2014 at 12:32 PM.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by yogegoy View Post
    I like my Audison Bit One and want to try a Helix P or C DSP just to see what they have to play around with.
    These thing look like the next level of the game for sure. It's got my name written all over it...but I will have to wait before I can spend that kind of money yet. I am salivating though.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Elvenking View Post
    I hear what yer saying. I will read more up on that thing. It looks fantastic and I can't find a negative thing about it. With 31 bands and that much cut, you should be able to achieve anything. I don't think I am getting the level of cut I need in some frequencies in order to achieve higher volumes with SQ using the built in alpine 9-band
    Having that level of control will likely reveal the source of your issue. Needing excessive boost or cut at a given frequency is more likely an acoustic issue that can be solved through re-locating drivers or phase adjustment (assuming the issue is at or around crossover points). Going "active" crossover may help a lot as well.

    It really sounds to me like you're using your 9-band as a Band-Aid to fix something that's some other problem.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    an inadequate electrical system can also cause the sound quality to deteriorate, especially in the highs when your amp has faint signs of clipping.



    Clip city b1tch, clip clip city b1tch. 10's, 12's, 15's, goin up in flames b1tch.

    Subs : C2 threatcons
    Sub amp: hifonics brx 2400.1D x 2
    Mids/Highs: PPI Phantom 900.4 - bought from dragnix
    Headunit: Pioneer 80PRS
    Front stage: Massive Audio CKX 6x9 components with jbl ms62C for rear fill (Its a van, I need rear fill) db drive Pro 6.5s comming soon
    320 amp Singer alt comming soon. Just a group 31 deka in the back atm with big 3 finished.

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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by hispls View Post
    Having that level of control will likely reveal the source of your issue. Needing excessive boost or cut at a given frequency is more likely an acoustic issue that can be solved through re-locating drivers or phase adjustment (assuming the issue is at or around crossover points). Going "active" crossover may help a lot as well.

    It really sounds to me like you're using your 9-band as a Band-Aid to fix something that's some other problem.
    Not all acoustical issues inside cars can be solved....and I don't know of any other settings\treatments I can do. I cannot relocate drivers, it is not practical and I see no other locations available. If you have any ideas as to how I could do that, please let me know. The best I might be able to do is to get different angles at current positions...but it will take a bit to get to that. What measures do you think I should take to eliminate shrill at high volumes? I agree, it seems excessive to need that much cut at 1.2K, 2.6K and 4K...but while using a Sine generator...I can tell that is where it hurts....so I apply 4-7 DB cuts at those points...not really excessive as I can see it, but what else would cause the shrill with music that is saturating the entire bandwidth like slammed level CD's. Older ones with better dynamic headroom...they sound great. Don't get the idea that it sounds horrible in my car....it seems to need a little additional help getting louder. If there are additional treatments I can do...I would be willing to try. In the Sentra...the speakers do have a slight angled tilt to the listening positions....but the tweets could be better...I will try to adjust those first. Overall, I have dealt with worse interiors than the Sentra...it sounds pretty dead for the most part.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffdachef View Post
    an inadequate electrical system can also cause the sound quality to deteriorate, especially in the highs when your amp has faint signs of clipping.
    Yeah, you simply don't get the same power from your amps without solid power....looks like I have that at last measurement..




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    If anyone has some great tuning techniques they would like to share around RTA's that would be welcome too. I think I mentioned that I use the FFT RTA to get things initially as close to flat as possible, then use a sine generator to slowly sweep from low to high looking for where my ears begin to reel from shrill...I knock those freqs down quite a bit cause they are perceived so much louder and harmful. Those freqs seemed to be at 315, 1.2K, 2.6K and 4K. I certainly could use a bit more time with the system to keep tweaking...it's still pretty new.




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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Elvenking View Post
    If anyone has some great tuning techniques they would like to share around RTA's that would be welcome too. I think I mentioned that I use the FFT RTA to get things initially as close to flat as possible, then use a sine generator to slowly sweep from low to high looking for where my ears begin to reel from shrill...I knock those freqs down quite a bit cause they are perceived so much louder and harmful. Those freqs seemed to be at 315, 1.2K, 2.6K and 4K. I certainly could use a bit more time with the system to keep tweaking...it's still pretty new.
    What's the crossover point between mid and tweeter



    "When I listen to a stereo loudspeaker playback in my room and an auditory scene has formed in my mind, how would I know that what I hear is an accurate replica of an auditory scene that could be had at the recording venue? Or more generally, that this is an auditory scene that could have existed at all?"


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    Re: Solving The EQ Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by calebkhill View Post
    What's the crossover point between mid and tweeter
    I have a passive setup with the comps up front using the Morel Tempo 6 Xover Unit that came with them. Here is all the specs you'd ever want to know I believe. I elected to not attenuate the tweeter -3db and left it at zero.

    Overall Specs:
    http://www.morelhifi.com/wp-content/...empo-2-way.pdf

    Manual (Includes a rough Xover graph showing x over around 4K)
    http://www.morelhifi.com/wp-content/..._2-way_5_6.pdf




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