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    Icon13 Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    So I want to tell everyone how paypal screwed me over. I had a recent transaction with @Laneyrw ; selling 2 pairs of 5.25" Morel MW5 mids that I had. He originally asked if he could do a trade with me for an oldschool zapco amp that he had. I didn't really want to do a trade but I said send me pics anyway and I might consider it. I wasn't very happy with the condition so I said no. He still wanted the speakers anyway but he had to check his finances first. I lowered the price down to $200 shipped for both pairs to give him incentive to pick it up.

    BACKSTORY: I originally bought these speakers about a year ago on ebay for $340, which I thought was a good deal considering it was $400 a pair new. I tested them out by using an old headunit and AGM battery. Didn't want to damage them so I played it at very low volume full range and just put my ear next to each one. Sounded good to me and never thought anything of it. I thought that my mercedes front speakers were 5.25" according to crutchfield and many other sources but when installing the speakers I found out it was actually 6.5". I decided to go along with the install anyway with just one pair. CSCStang, a member here, helped me with the install and suggested to cut up some insulation material to cover up the gap and create a seal. I ran the speakers in my car for about 8 months give or take. Sounded pretty good, never noticed anything weird or any indication that the speakers were not playing correctly. Had it all hooked up with 80prs HU running active crossovers at 2k and hpf at 120hz. Tried crossing them down to 63hz and I was surprised how low it went for a 5" speaker but my doors would rattle like crazy so I had to cross them higher. Had them on a 4 ch JBL amp 65wx4 @ 4 ohms. I felt it wasn't loud enough for me so I bought a class D zapco amp that did 185x4 and then recently just swapped to 6.5" B2 mids that I just got. I had the other pair sitting in my closet the entire time, never installed or anything. I was just going to keep both pairs and make a DIY boombox project out of it. I realized I have way too much car audio equipment laying around in my closet and I didn't want these to go to waste so I thought maybe someone else could have better use for these so I posted on classified. I knew they were gonna be hard to sell because of the 5.25" size so I was willing to sell them dirt cheap.

    So when it came to the transaction with Laneyrw, I asked him can you send the money as a gift to help me out with the paypal fees. I've done a few transactions like this on this site based on trust and never had an issue. I would only do this with long time members and good credit-ability. Because I would think anyone on here for a long time with good reviews would not want to ruin your reputation over a small deal like this. I said we can make a thread on here to put everything on record. Or you can just send me $205 and that should cover the paypal fees. So he sends me the $205 and I ship it out as soon as I possibly can. The next day was Columbus day and went to the post office like... uhhh wtf it's a holiday? So I ship it out the very next day in the early morning. Made sure to keep communication with the buyer the entire time. Everytime I sell something here, I always keep in contact to make sure everything went well and they are happy with it. I have made many friends on here as a result.

    When he gets the speakers, he does a test with his home audio equipment and says he hears vent noise and some ticking noise. He says it's not lead slap but says only 2 of them have any real issues. I asked where did you have them crossed at? he said at 2k and 45hz. I said 45hz is way too low and he says they are rated at 45hz. I check morel specs online and it says it plays from 45-3000hz. The FS is at 56hz. so based on that info I still think it should be crossed higher, maybe 63hz at the lowest. So he says he'll hook them up one more time with a proper amp and set crossovers alittle closer. I told him not to cross them at 45hz again bc it could maybe damage them. He says he knows what he's doing and he's ran active on his truck several times. I said ok I don't doubt that. Next day he says "all four speakers are blown to some point. They still work but sound so so bad. Had to grab a known set of good speakers to make sure." I was like wow really? all 4 are blown? He said he tested it out with an oldschool PG xenon 100.2 hooked up to his phone and the amp has a bandpass filter. He said he hooked up a pair of alpine type s components without the tweeter and it sounded great. He wanted a refund and from that point on i told him ok sure no problem. I was willing to take the loss and the responsibility and did not make a fuss about it. It didn't make sense to both of us but hey whatever, it's only $200. Not that big of a deal to me, I just wanted to give him his refund asap and be done with it.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    So this is the first time for both of us dealing with a refund so I didn't know how it worked. I thought it was gonna be easy. On october 14, he starts out by filing a claim saying that the item was not as described. Instantly, my paypal balance is -200 and so I thought the refund is already given to him. My account was frozen until I paid it. That day I remember I needed to pay a friend $65 thru gift from money I owed him. It wouldn't send the money instantly like normal so I thought ok maybe I need to transfer $200 into my paypal account first so that it's at 0. I did that and later I found out that when I sent the $65, it automatically took $265 because of the balance that was owed. So actually I sent $400 to paypal by accident and it took over a week to send! OMG

    Oct 17, I ask him did you send out the package yet? He said no I need you to reply on paypal and allow me to return it with a shipping label. So I send him the address on paypal website. A few days pass and he says sorry that he hasn't shipped them out yet, he got called into work. I said ok sure no problem. Just let me know. It arrives on Oct 26 but it was sent to my brother's house so I need to drive an hour to get there. I picked it up the very next day but I was just so busy with work that weekend that I didn't even get a chance to inspect the speakers. He gets mad and says you have had 2 days to check the speakers out I would like my refund. If I do not get it by tmr I will have to contact paypal and escalate the problem to them. It sounded a little threatening to me like as if I didn't want to give him a refund but I cooperated anyway. I asked how do I send the refund? He doesn't have a clear answer on how to do this so I decide to figure it out myself. I log into my paypal and click on the pending case and the only option I see is respond back by message. I clicked on everything and do not see the option. I even look on google on how to give a refund on paypal and it doesn't show up the same way it does for me. I mentioned to him that I never got back my Morel decal sticker and he said that he'll try to find it and send it back to me. He says if ur unable to figure it out I'll have to get up at 5am and call them. I said I will call tomorrow too. Next day I call and talk to a paypal representative. I tell him about my pending case and ask how do I give a refund? The rep says well you need to resolve the issue with the buyer first and if both parties cannot resolve it then paypal will step in and investigate. I say it's already been resolved between us. The buyer sent me the speakers back and I want to give him a refund now. Rep says so if I'm hearing you correctly you received the item back undamaged, in the same condition as you sent it? I knew I was missing the morel sticker but I really did not care at that point so I told him yes everything is good. Rep says it will take up to 24 hours to process the refund. I thought that was weird but I believed him because he's a paypal rep, he should know better and everything is recorded. I asked him why I couldn't give him a refund through the site and he replied that I cannot do a refund on there once a claim is started. It has to be resolved first. He said they're working on incorporating a refund option on the phone app but currently there is none. Would've been nice to have that option when I needed it.

    So I text Laneyrw back and tell him I called paypal and that they'll be issuing a refund within 24 hours. Let me know when u get ur funds. He replies back and says "Thanks so much I've been busy all day". So I left it at that and thought everything was squared away. A day passes by and I hear nothing from him thinking maybe he's busy on halloween. The next day after that on Nov 1, I wake up and see a negative feedback on this site. I'm like WTF! I text him and say wait how come you gave me a negative review? You could've just let me know what's going on. He says "I contacted paypal and u have not tried to return payment even after u said they told u it just b 24 hours." So at this point he does not believe anything I say and has already told paypal to escalate it. I tell him it's all a big misunderstanding and that I'll call them RIGHT NOW. I call and a nice lady picks up and I got furious and bi*ched her out about how I called 2 days ago to issue a refund and when my buyer called you guys about the status, you guys told him that I never even tried to give him a refund. Laney said that paypal tried to contact me, which they never did. In fact, it was ME who contacted them! She apologized and said they will be filing a complaint for the last representative that I talked to. She closed the case and was able to give him a refund instantly over the phone just like that. Poor lady had to take the yelling, should've been the other guy for slacking off so hard. The first rep did absolutely nothing for me and is contradictory of what the 2nd rep said. I could tell from both the rep's accents that they're philipino, which leads me to believe that paypal is outsourcing their CS where their wage is very low. SHAME ON PAYPAL! They phucked me over bad and now I'm stuck with this negative feedback.. Makes me not wanna use paypal anymore. I haven't had a chance to test speakers out yet but will try to get around to it. Laneyrw has since tried to submit a change to the review but it still stays negative.

    If there are any mods alive still, can you help me out.



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    Papermaker85's Avatar
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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    hes a *******. user error. tell him his fault.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Blazian87 took care of me and the issue was payal. Wish this site worked like it should and this problem wouldn't have gotten this far. Thanks balzian for the refund and im sorry that I can't fix the review.




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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Laneyrw View Post
    Blazian87 took care of me and the issue was payal. Wish this site worked like it should and this problem wouldn't have gotten this far. Thanks balzian for the refund and im sorry that I can't fix the review.
    you cannot cross any midbass at 45hz with any volume. i would kept my money.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    yeah crossed to low and probably overpowered he just blew your **** and complained about you, what a ho




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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    What a putz ! "He says he knows what he's doing and he's ran active on his truck several times. I said ok I don't doubt that. Next day he says "all four speakers are blown to some point". REALLY 45hz ? and no doubt with full power? He trashes all four speakers and then trashes you and you rep ? Must be a kid cuz real men take there lumps when they tear up equipment not blame someone else and then screw them over ! Thats why I dont even try to sell equipment anymore. Just gave a boatload of crap to kids down the street and I came out better than you did because you lost shipping too ! Freakin sad the way people are anymore, no morals at all !



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Quote Originally Posted by ChaseinBass View Post
    What a putz ! "He says he knows what he's doing and he's ran active on his truck several times. I said ok I don't doubt that. Next day he says "all four speakers are blown to some point". REALLY 45hz ? and no doubt with full power? He trashes all four speakers and then trashes you and you rep ? Must be a kid cuz real men take there lumps when they tear up equipment not blame someone else and then screw them over ! Thats why I dont even try to sell equipment anymore. Just gave a boatload of crap to kids down the street and I came out better than you did because you lost shipping too ! Freakin sad the way people are anymore, no morals at all !
    yea. he needs an *** whipping. my custom built mids with 7mm xmax cant take 100 watts at 45hz without sounding bad much less 5". id tell him kiss my ***.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Quote Originally Posted by ChaseinBass View Post
    real men take there lumps when they tear up equipment

    The way I read this, OP dropped the ball by not thoroughly testing these when he got them. At this point the only one who knows for sure is the guy from whom OP bought them.




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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Just sounds like a sh!tty situation for everyone... People sometimes just need to calm down. I had a paypal transaction where a guy tried to get me to issue a refund for a MMATS 2000.05D I sold to him. It was absolutely MINT when I tested it and sold it. He said when he turned it on with his test bench it went straight to protect and he already called MMATS and they said it was blown. I was about to blow my lid and freak out with a response to paypal but was driving and couldn't respond at that moment. 5 minutes later I get a return retraction from Ebay, the buyer apparently hooked it up wrong and said it works great.... Had the guy took his time none of this would have happened.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Quote Originally Posted by blazian87 View Post
    So this is the first time for both of us dealing with a refund so I didn't know how it worked. I thought it was gonna be easy. On october 14, he starts out by filing a claim saying that the item was not as described. Instantly, my paypal balance is -200 and so I thought the refund is already given to him. My account was frozen until I paid it. That day I remember I needed to pay a friend $65 thru gift from money I owed him. It wouldn't send the money instantly like normal so I thought ok maybe I need to transfer $200 into my paypal account first so that it's at 0. I did that and later I found out that when I sent the $65, it automatically took $265 because of the balance that was owed. So actually I sent $400 to paypal by accident and it took over a week to send! OMG

    Oct 17, I ask him did you send out the package yet? He said no I need you to reply on paypal and allow me to return it with a shipping label. So I send him the address on paypal website. A few days pass and he says sorry that he hasn't shipped them out yet, he got called into work. I said ok sure no problem. Just let me know. It arrives on Oct 26 but it was sent to my brother's house so I need to drive an hour to get there. I picked it up the very next day but I was just so busy with work that weekend that I didn't even get a chance to inspect the speakers. He gets mad and says you have had 2 days to check the speakers out I would like my refund. If I do not get it by tmr I will have to contact paypal and escalate the problem to them. It sounded a little threatening to me like as if I didn't want to give him a refund but I cooperated anyway. I asked how do I send the refund? He doesn't have a clear answer on how to do this so I decide to figure it out myself. I log into my paypal and click on the pending case and the only option I see is respond back by message. I clicked on everything and do not see the option. I even look on google on how to give a refund on paypal and it doesn't show up the same way it does for me. I mentioned to him that I never got back my Morel decal sticker and he said that he'll try to find it and send it back to me. He says if ur unable to figure it out I'll have to get up at 5am and call them. I said I will call tomorrow too. Next day I call and talk to a paypal representative. I tell him about my pending case and ask how do I give a refund? The rep says well you need to resolve the issue with the buyer first and if both parties cannot resolve it then paypal will step in and investigate. I say it's already been resolved between us. The buyer sent me the speakers back and I want to give him a refund now. Rep says so if I'm hearing you correctly you received the item back undamaged, in the same condition as you sent it? I knew I was missing the morel sticker but I really did not care at that point so I told him yes everything is good. Rep says it will take up to 24 hours to process the refund. I thought that was weird but I believed him because he's a paypal rep, he should know better and everything is recorded. I asked him why I couldn't give him a refund through the site and he replied that I cannot do a refund on there once a claim is started. It has to be resolved first. He said they're working on incorporating a refund option on the phone app but currently there is none. Would've been nice to have that option when I needed it.

    So I text Laneyrw back and tell him I called paypal and that they'll be issuing a refund within 24 hours. Let me know when u get ur funds. He replies back and says "Thanks so much I've been busy all day". So I left it at that and thought everything was squared away. A day passes by and I hear nothing from him thinking maybe he's busy on halloween. The next day after that on Nov 1, I wake up and see a negative feedback on this site. I'm like WTF! I text him and say wait how come you gave me a negative review? You could've just let me know what's going on. He says "I contacted paypal and u have not tried to return payment even after u said they told u it just b 24 hours." So at this point he does not believe anything I say and has already told paypal to escalate it. I tell him it's all a big misunderstanding and that I'll call them RIGHT NOW. I call and a nice lady picks up and I got furious and bi*ched her out about how I called 2 days ago to issue a refund and when my buyer called you guys about the status, you guys told him that I never even tried to give him a refund. Laney said that paypal tried to contact me, which they never did. In fact, it was ME who contacted them! She apologized and said they will be filing a complaint for the last representative that I talked to. She closed the case and was able to give him a refund instantly over the phone just like that. Poor lady had to take the yelling, should've been the other guy for slacking off so hard. The first rep did absolutely nothing for me and is contradictory of what the 2nd rep said. I could tell from both the rep's accents that they're philipino, which leads me to believe that paypal is outsourcing their CS where their wage is very low. SHAME ON PAYPAL! They phucked me over bad and now I'm stuck with this negative feedback.. Makes me not wanna use paypal anymore. I haven't had a chance to test speakers out yet but will try to get around to it. Laneyrw has since tried to submit a change to the review but it still stays negative.

    If there are any mods alive still, can you help me out.
    What would you like a mod to do?

    Also for what its worth. I would never ever issue a refund or a return for a guy who says he used speakers incorrectly and that they dont work. It proves he was the last one to touch them and fuck them up.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    45hz is WAY too low for a 5inch speaker. Crossing at 45z you're still feeding it freqs that are far below that...the crossover point is where the signal STARTS to be attenuated...it doesn't just do 45hz then stop.

    Usually for smaller drivers 2x FS @12db is a good place to start...not BELOW.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Quote Originally Posted by NSTALN View Post
    45hz is WAY too low for a 5inch speaker. Crossing at 45z you're still feeding it freqs that are far below that...the crossover point is where the signal STARTS to be attenuated...it doesn't just do 45hz then stop.

    Usually for smaller drivers 2x FS @12db is a good place to start...not BELOW.
    After 15 years experience I would never cross a 5 inch speaker below 120 hertz with any real power



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Wow that was one hell of a read.

    Why refund a user error?? You felt bad about situation, he got what he wanted. He won.



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    Re: Paypal CS su*ks @SS

    Quote Originally Posted by hispls View Post
    The way I read this, OP dropped the ball by not thoroughly testing these when he got them. At this point the only one who knows for sure is the guy from whom OP bought them.
    My point exactly, which is why I took responsibility. Everyone blames user error but the fact is I never tested thoroughly. Only 1 pair I ran in my car but it still might have been possible that they were partially blown and I never even noticed. The other pair I never even ran so there's a chance that they were all damaged to some extent when I bought them. I need to actually test all 4 speakers in a proper setting to determine if it's even salvageable.



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